HC Deb 01 May 1995 vol 259 cc116-8

Amendment proposed: No. 154, in page 13, line 4, at end insert— '(5) If, for the purpose of protecting members of the public from serious harm (whether or not physical harm)—

  1. (a) a children's hearing consider it necessary to make a decision under or by virtue of this Part of this Act which (but for this paragraph) would not be consistent with their affording paramountcy to the consideration mentioned in subsection (1) above, they may make that decision; or
  2. (b) a court considers it necessary to make a determination under or by virtue of Chapters 1 to 3 of this Part of this Act which (but for this paragraph ) would not be consistent with its affording such paramountcy, it may make that determination.'.—[Lord James Douglas-Hamilton.]
Question put, That the amendment be made.

Mrs. Fyfe

Just a brief question—

Mr. Deputy Speaker

Order. This has already been debated. I have just put the Question.

Mrs. Fyfe

On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I know that it has been debated but we have not voted on it.

Mr. Deputy Speaker

I shall put the question and, if hon. Members wish to vote, they may do so. We cannot debate it further.

Question put, That the amendment be made:—

The House divided: Ayes 208, Noes 63.

Division No. 141] [9.30 pm
Ainsworth, Peter (East Surrey) Burt, Alistair
Alison, Rt Hon Michael (Selby) Butcher, John
Allason, Rupert (Torbay) Butler, Peter
Ancram, Michael Carlisle, Sir Kenneth (Lincoln)
Arbuthnot, James Carttiss, Michael
Arnold, Jacques (Gravesham) Cash, William
Arnold, Sir Thomas (Hazel Grv) Chapman, Sydney
Ashby, David Clarke, Rt Hon Kenneth (Ru'clif)
Atkins, Robert Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey
Atkinson, David (Bour'mouth E) Coe, Sebastian
Atkinson, Peter (Hexham) Congdon, David
Baker, Nicholas (North Dorset) Conway, Derek
Baldry, Tony Coombs, Anthony (Wyre For'st)
Bates, Michael Coombs, Simon (Swindon)
Batiste, Spencer Cope, Rt Hon Sir John
Bellingham, Henry Couchman, James
Beresford, Sir Paul Cran, James
Biffen, Rt Hon John Davies, Quent'n (Stamford)
Body, Sir Richard Davis, David (Boothferry)
Booth, Hartley Day, Stephen
Boswell, Tim Deva, Nirj Joseph
Bowis, John Devlin, Tim
Boyson, Rt Hon Sir Rhodes Dicks, Terry
Brandreth, Gyles Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James
Brazier, Julian Dover, Den
Bright, Sir Graham Duncan, Alan
Brooke, Rt Hon Peter Duncan-Smith, Iain
Browning, Mrs Angela Dunn, Bob
Bruce, Ian (Dorset) Durant, Sir Anthony
Budgen, Nicholas Dykes, Hugh
Burns, Simon Elletson, Harold
Evans, David (Welwyn Hatfield) Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling)
Evans, Jonathan (Brecon) Monro, Sir Hector
Evans, Nigel (Ribble Valley) Nelson, Anthony
Evans, Roger (Monmouth) Neubert, Sir Michael
Faber, David Nicholls, Patrick
Fabricant, Michael Nicholson, David (Taunton)
Fenner, Dame Peggy Oppenheim, Phillip
Field, Barry (Isle of Wight) Ottaway, Richard
Fishbum, Dudley Page, Richard
Forman, Nigel Paice, James
Forsyth, Rt Hon Michael (Stirling) Patnick, Sir Irvine
Forth, Eric Pattie, Rt Hon Sir Geoffrey
Fox, Dr Liam (Woodspring) Pickles, Eric
Freeman, Rt Hon Roger Porter, David (Waveney)
French, Douglas Portillo, Rt Hon Michael
Fry, Sir Peter Rathbone, Tim
Gale, Roger Richards, Rod
Gallie, Phil Rifkind, Rt Hon Malcolm
Gardiner, Sir George Robertson, Raymond (Ab'd'n S)
Gill, Christopher Robinson, Mark (Somerton)
Gillan, Cheryl Roe, Mrs Marion (Broxboume)
Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles Rowe, Andrew (Mid Kent)
Gorman, Mrs Teresa Ryder, Rt Hon Richard
Gorst, Sir John Sackville, Tom
Grant,Sir A(SW Cambs) Shaw, David (Dover)
Greenway, Harry (Eating N) Shaw, Sir Giles (Pudsey)
Greenway, John (Ryedale) Shepherd, Colin (Hereford)
Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth, N) Shersby, Michael
Hague, William Sims, Roger
Hamilton, Rt Hon Sir Archibald Skeet, Sir Trevor
Hampson, Dr Keith Smith, Tim (Beaconsfield)
Hannam, Sir John Soames, Nicholas
Hargreaves, Andrew Spencer, Sir Derek
Harris, David Spicer, Michael (S Worcs)
Heald, Oliver Spink, Dr Robert
Hendry, Charles Sproat, Iain
Hicks, Robert Squire, Robin (Hornchurch)
Hill, James (Southampton Test) Stanley, Rt Hon Sir John
Hordem, Rt Hon Sir Peter Stephen, Michael
Howard, Rt Hon Michael Stem, Michael
Howarth, Alan (Strat'rd-on-A) Streeter, Gary
Hughes, Robert G (Harrow W) Sumberg, David
Hunt, Sir John (Ravensboume) Sykes, John
Hunter, Andrew Taylor, John M (Solihull)
Jack, Michael Taylor, Sir Teddy (Southend, E)
Jackson, Robert (Wantage) Temple-Morris, Peter
Jenkin, Bernard Thomason, Roy
Jessel, Toby Thompson, Sir Donald (Cer V)
Jones, Robert B (W Hertfdshr) Thompson, Patrick (Norwich N)
Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine Thornton, Sir Malcolm
King, Rt Hon Tom Thumham, Peter
Knapman, Roger Townsend, Cyril D (Bexl'yh'th)
Knight, Mrs Angela (Erewash) Trotter, Neville
Knight, Greg (Derby N) Twinn, Dr Ian
Knox, Sir David Vaughan, Sir Gerard
Kynoch, George (Kincardine) Walker, Bill (N Tayside)
Lait, Mrs Jacqui Waller, Gary
Lang, Rt Hon Ian Ward, John
Lawrence, Sir Ivan Wardle, Charles (Bexhill)
Legg, Barry Waterson, Nigel
Lennox-Boyd, Sir Mark Watts, John
Lidington, David Wells, Bowen
Lightbown, David Whitney, Ray
Lord, Michael Whittingdale, John
Luff, Peter Widdecombe, Ann
Lyell, Rt Hon Sir Nicholas Wiggin, Sir Jerry
MacKay, Andrew Wilkinson, John
McLoughlin, Patrick Willetts, David
Maitland, Lady Olga Winterton, Mrs Ann (Congleton)
Malone, Gerald Wolfson, Mark
Marlow, Tony Young, Rt Hon Sir George
Martin, David (Portsmouth S)
Mawhinney, Rt Hon Dr Brian Tellers for the Ayes:
Merchant, Piers Mr. Timothy Wood and
Mills, Iain Mr. Timothy Kirkhope.
Adams, Mrs Irene Kennedy, Charles (Ross, C&S)
Ashdown, Rt Hon Paddy Liddell, Mrs Helen
Banks, Tony (Newham NW) McAllion, John
Barnes, Harry McAvoy, Thomas
Battle, John McFall, John
Betts, Clive McKelvey, William
Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) Maclennan, Robert
Caravan, Dennis McMaster, Gordon
Chisholm, Malcolm Mahon, Alice
Clarke, Eric (Midlothian) Marshall, David (Shettleston)
Cunningham, Jim (Covy SE) Michie, Mrs Ray (Argyll & Bute)
Dalyell, Tarn O'Brien, William (Normanton)
Darling, Alistair Olner, Bill
Davidson, Ian Pike, Peter L
Dixon, Don Powell, Ray (Ogmore)
Donohoe, Brian H Raynsford, Nick
Dowd, Jim Redmond, Martin
Dunnachie, Jimmy Reid, Dr John
Rendel, David
Ewing, Mrs Margaret Robertson, George (Hamilton)
Flynn, Paul Rooney, Terry
Foster, Don (Bath) Ross, Ernie (Dundee W)
Fyfe, Maria Simpson, Alan
Galbraith, Sam Skinner, Dennis
Golding, Mrs Uin Spellar, John
Graham, Thomas Steinberg, Gerry
Griffiths, Nigel (Edinburgh S) Taylor, Mrs Ann (Dewsbury)
Hanson, David Wallace, James
Hardy, Peter Welsh, Andrew
Hoyie, Doug Wray, Jimmy
Illsley, Eric
Ingram, Adam Tellers for the Noes:
Jones, Barry (Alyn and D'side) Dr. Norman A. Godman and
Jones, Jon Owen (Cardiff C) Mr. Michael Conarty.

Question accordingly agreed to.

Forward to