Framework Document (Hansard, 19 January 1995)

§ 8. Mr. Barnes
To ask the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a statement on the progress of discussions with the Irish Government on a framework document.

§ Mr. Ancram
We continue to make useful progress; there are still important questions to be resolved. My right hon. and learned Friend the Secretary of State hopes to meet the Tanaiste shortly to discuss the framework document. We hope that a shared understanding of potential areas of agreement with the parties may be reached reasonably soon.

§ Mr. Barnes
The framework document is of key importance to future peace and progress throughout the island of Ireland. It is therefore to be hoped that elements of co-operation in the development of jobs and travel, for example, will be extended. For instance in Ireland, but not in Northern Ireland, there is free travel for pensioners. However, might it not be pushing things too far to say that 841 what should be developed in the framework document at this stage is a call for joint executive boards, which would present all the problems concerning sovereignty?

§ Mr. Ancram
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his question, but, as he would expect, I shall not become involved at this time in detailed discussion of the framework document. It is worth remembering that the purpose of that document is to form a basis for a shared understanding between the two Governments, in order to bring the parties back round a table to negotiate a political settlement. It would therefore be unwise, to say the least, for anything to be in the framework document which would prevent the parties from coming to the table. We certainly bear that consideration closely in mind in our negotiations with the Irish Government.

§ Mr. Wilshire
Can my hon. Friend assure the House that the framework document will contain no reference whatever to all-Ireland bodies that might have Executive powers over Northern Ireland?

§ Mr. Ancram
It has been made clear all along that relationships between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland will form part of the three-stranded process of discussion, and that those relationships will be institutionalised. The Secretary of State has already made it clear that there will be cross-border bodies with some Executive powers, but that the centrally important factors will be the extent, nature, source and accountability of such powers. Clearly, hon. Members will wish to study those when the document is eventually published.

§ Dr. Hendron
Will the Secretary of State guarantee that, irrespective of the contents of the framework document, and, indeed, of that of the other document that the Government are preparing, nothing will be imposed on the nationalist or the unionist people of Northern Ireland, and that agreement and consent will be the order of the day?

§ Mr. Ancram
The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. The key to the whole process is agreement and acceptability. That is why we made it clear that the framework document will be not a blueprint to be imposed but a shared understanding between the two Governments, which we hope will form the basis for taking negotiations forward. After those negotiations, as the hon. Gentleman rightly said, must come agreement with the political parties. And the Prime Minister has made it clear that even after that, before any outcome can be implemented, there will be a referendum for the people of Northern Ireland. So the whole process must ultimately depend on agreement and acceptability.

§ Ms Mowlam
Will the Minister try answering the question that the Secretary of State failed six times to answer this afternoon? If he does not feel up to that, perhaps he can reassure the House that items in the framework document will not, in the weeks ahead, be negotiated into or out of it according to the Government's electoral expediency.

§ Mr. Ancram
I am surprised at the hon. Lady's cynicism. I thought that she was going to bring a fresh attitude to her party's policy on Northern Ireland. I am disappointed that she takes this line.
842 The hon. Lady must consider what the purpose of the framework document is. It is not a blueprint; it is not a settled policy as between two Governments which will then be imposed. It is the basis for further discussion and negotiation. What is in it and what is not in it will be as much a part of those conversations and negotiations as it is a matter for the two Governments at this time.