HC Deb 06 February 1995 vol 254 cc11-2
12. Mr. Charles Kennedy

To ask the Secretary of State for Transport if he will make a statement on progress towards rail privatisation.

Dr. Mawhinney

Preparations are under way for the stock market flotation of Railtrack. The first franchise contracts are due to be awarded by the end of 1995 and we plan to have 51 per cent. of them in private hands by April 1996. The maintenance depots of British Rail should be in private sector ownership shortly. The three rolling stock leasing companies and the freight companies are set for sale during 1995.

Mr. Kennedy

Is the Secretary of State aware of the great concern and downright offence felt by Highland regional council because the Department has not seen fit to respond properly to the council's request, which it first made on 21 December, for a meeting arising from the franchising director's pre-emptive statement about the ending of the sleeper service to Fort William? The regional council will lobby the Scottish Grand Committee in the House on Wednesday morning, when it will meet to debate that and related matters. Will the right hon. Gentleman or one of his colleagues take the opportunity to meet a delegation from the council to explain why categorical assurances given by the previous Minister to the region about the sleeper service have not been upheld?

Dr. Mawhinney

I understand the concern that has been expressed locally but, as I want to be fair, I must tell the hon. Gentleman that the taxpayers' subsidy per person for a sleeper berth on the trip to Fort William, excluding the infrastructure cost, is £180. If one adds the cost of the infrastructure, that subsidy becomes £540. Given those figures, it seems reasonable that there should be public consultation, as there will be when the franchising director produces—

Mr. Kennedy

That is wrong.

Dr. Mawhinney

I assure the hon. Gentleman, and I think that he will accept this from me, that when the franchising director produces his passenger service requirements for ScotRail, there will be consultation on whatever proposal is or is not included with respect to Fort William.

Sir Roger Moate

I welcome the progress that my right hon. Friend has mentioned towards rail privatisation, but should not we recollect that, under public ownership, the last Labour Government cut public sector rail investment year after year and that the Labour Government before that closed 4,000 miles of track? Does not that emphasise the fact that if we are to have a railway of which we can be proud, it will be achieved only through private sector investment and private enterprise?

Dr. Mawhinney

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Neither he nor I would want to add to the embarrassment of the Labour party, but, as I understand it, its proposals are to take British Rail back into the public sector, so that it can continue to decline in relative terms as it has for the past 40 years.

Mr. Meacher

Will the right hon. Gentleman confirm that, when the Railways Bill was being considered in Committee, Ministers promised that passenger train services would be franchised on the basis of the current timetable, whereas the franchising director has now revealed that there will be major cuts; that through-ticketing stations would remain as now, yet the Rail Regulator has now revealed that there will be huge reductions; that there would be no investment hiatus as a result of privatisation, yet this year, for the first time since the war, there are no new orders for rolling stock; and that Railtrack would remain in the public sector until last, yet it is being offered first for sale to fit in with the Chancellor's Budget arithmetic? Is not it true that every single promise that Ministers have made—that services would improve under privatisation—has now clearly been shown to be false? Is not it high time that the Government listened for once to the 85 per cent. of the electorate—including a majority of Conservatives—who now demand that the crazy idea of privatising the railways be scrapped?

Dr. Mawhinney

To quote a distinguished former Prime Minister, "No, no, no." I will take time tomorrow yet again to try to explain to the hon. Gentleman—who has no idea how the private sector works, but given his background he would not—precisely the benefits that will accrue to passengers: wait until tomorrow.