HC Deb 28 June 1994 vol 245 cc708-11

Lords amendment: No. 17, in page 102, line 29, after ("by") insert ("or in accordance with the directions of")

Mr. Eggar

I beg to move, That this House doth agree with the Lords in the said amendment.

Mr. Deputy Speaker

With this it will be convenient to take Lords amendments Nos. 18 to 22.

Mr. Eggar

This series of technical amendments relates to pensions provision. Let me record my thanks to all who have been involved in discussions about the pensions issue—the trustees of the many schemes and all who have worked to assist them. I also thank the Opposition formally for the co-operative way in which they have approached the debate.

I think that there was always a genuine worry, shared by hon. Members on both sides of the House, that a technical but emotive issue would enter the political arena in a way that would upset many elderly pensioners for no good reason. The mining industry as a whole—unions and trustees—and hon. Members on both sides of the House have co-operated to bring about an outcome that is satisfactory from all points of view, without upsetting pensioners.

Mr. O'Neill

I join the Minister in thanking the trustees, who devoted considerable time and effort to wide consultation on the nature of the changes. When they went to Ministers, those Ministers had to heed what was being said, because pensioners, beneficiaries, trustees and others had a strong case to make. Ministers recognised that, and the necessary changes have been made—to the general appreciation, although not necessarily the overwhelming satisfaction, of most people.

Some 97 per cent. of members of the scheme are now beneficiaries, and a very small number are still contributors. It is therefore essential that proper provision be made for the long term. As I have said, it is to the trustees' credit that consensus was established: the arrangements were sold to the Government in a constructive way, and our constituents who are beneficiaries can now look forward to the future with far more certainty than they could when the Bill first appeared.

The Opposition pay tribute to all who played a substantial part in trying to make this section of the Bill benefit people who have made a great contribution to a once great industry, and to the economic well-being of the country.

Question put and agreed to.

Lords amendment: No. 23, in page 102, line 50, leave out sub-paragraph (4) and insert—

("(3A) The modifications of an existing scheme that may be made by regulations under this paragraph shall include modifications making such provision as the Secretary of State considers appropriate for cases where either—
  1. (a) there are assets of the scheme representing a relevant surplus, or
  2. (b) the assets of the scheme are insufficient for meeting pension obligations under the scheme.
 (3B) The modifications mentioned in sub-paragraph (3A) above may contain—
  1. (a) provision for a relevant surplus, and the assets representing it, to be apportioned between—
    1. (i) the part (if any) of the surplus which is to be retained in a reserve ("an investment reserve") as an asset of the scheme, and
    2. (ii) the remainder ("the distributable part") of the surplus;
  2. (b) provision for the management of assets representing an investment reserve and for the manner in which any such assets are to be applied;
  3. (c) provision for income accruing in respect of assets representing an investment reserve to be added to the reserve;
  4. (d) provision for the manner in which assets representing the distributable part of a relevant surplus are to be applied; and
  5. (e) provision, for the purposes of any provision under paragraphs (a) to (d) above, for modifying any decisions' as to the way in which relevant surpluses determined as at times before the restructuring date. and the assets representing any such surpluses, are to be treated.
 (3C) The provision as to the apportionment of any surplus or assets to an investment reserve that may be contained in modification made by virtue of sub-paragraph (3A) above shall not include any provision authorising the allocation to such a reserve of any part of a surplus determined as at a time after 31st March 1994, or of any assets representing any part of such a surplus, except where the allocation is made for making good amounts that would have been comprised in the value of the reserve if assets representing any part of it had not been applied from the reserve in meeting a deficiency that arose as at any time by reason of the other assets of the scheme having been insufficient as at that time for meeting pension obligations under the scheme. (3D) The provision as to the application of assets representing an investment reserve that may be contained in modifications made by virtue of sub-paragraph (3A) above shall include provision for the Secretary of State to become entitled where—
  1. (a) any such arrangements as are mentioned in sub-paragraph (5) below have been entered into in relation to pension obligations under the scheme in question, and
  2. (b) the value of the assets representing the reserve exceeds the aggregate amount required for the purposes for which the reserve has been retained,
to assets of the scheme representing the amount of the excess or, where those purposes have ceased, the value of the reserve. (3E) The provision as to the application of assets representing the distributable part of a relevant surplus that may be contained in modifications made by virtue of sub-paragraph (3A) above shall include provision for the Secretary of State to become entitled where—
  1. (a) the surplus is one determined as at a time on or after 31st March 1994, and
  2. (b) any such arrangements as are mentioned in sub-paragraph (5) below have been entered into in relation to pension obligations under the scheme in question,
to assets of the scheme representing no more than one half of the distributable part of that surplus.")

Amendment made to Lords amendment: In line 7 of proposed sub-paragraph (3C), leave out 'that' and insert 'which' (apart from any entitlement for which provision is made by virtue of sub-paragraph (3D) below)'.

Lords amendment, as amended, agreed to [Special Entry].

Subsequent Lords amendments agreed to [some with Special Entry].

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