Political Talks (Hansard, 21 January 1993)

§ 8. Mr. Winnick
To ask the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a statement on the latest talks he has had with Ministers in the Irish Republic concerning progress in the political talks relating to Northern Ireland.

§ Sir Patrick Mayhew
I am meeting Mr. Spring tomorrow.

§ Mr. Winnick
The whole House will welcome the fact that these talks are to take place, and one hopes that further discussions will take place with the new Irish Government. When they do, will both Governments make it clear how they deplore the continued killings such as, for example, that of the woman last weekend in Northern Ireland who was murdered for no other reason than that she happened to be a Catholic and those of the many who are murdered for no other reason than that they happen to be Protestant? Is not such ethnic cleansing as unacceptable and as much a crime against humanity as what is happening, albeit on a far larger scale, in what was Yugoslavia?

§ Sir Patrick Mayhew
The hon. Gentleman, who is invariably humane and balanced in his interest in Northern Ireland, is absolutely right: the killings that take place, whether caused by terrorists from one quarter of the community or another, are inexcusable, indefensible and fundamentally inhumane, and I do not doubt that my colleagues in the Government of the Republic take precisely the same view and will express it. What we must do is bear down, through the Royal Ulster Constabulary and with the Army in support, upon all organisations that are committed to the use of violence to gain political ends and always call upon people in the community to have the courage to come forward and, when they have the information, to tell the RUC what they know. These people will be defeated in the end, not simply by the security forces but by the people of Northern Ireland—and defeated they will be.

§ Mr. Bellingham
Will my right hon. and learned Friend be raising with the new Irish Foreign Minister the point about articles 2 and 3 of the Republic's constitution? Will he agree with me that until these two articles are reviewed, the chance of political talks succeeding is very slim?

§ Sir Patrick Mayhew
I do not wish to be drawn into speculation about the chances of success or failure. I think that the whole House wants these talks to succeed and recognises that, in the matters to be discussed, articles 2 and 3 will play an important part.

§ Mr. William Ross
Surely the Secretary of State will now realise that the expression that nothing is agreed until everything is agreed is no more than a bit of flotsam left behind the talks that ended last year, so that there is now no reason why progress should not be made where progress is easily possible.

§ Sir Patrick Mayhew
The hon. Gentleman has always taken a rather uncharacteristically morose view about the talks process, or so it seems to me; it is not a view which was shared by those taking part—and I am sorry that he was not of their number. I think that all the participants will want to consult together as to how best to take the talks forward, what formation and so forth, but I do not think that we will share the hon. Gentleman's rather gloomy view.