Common Agricultural Policy (Fraud) (Hansard, 29 April 1993)

§ 2. Mr. Whittingdale
To ask the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food what measures are being taken to tackle fraud in the common agricultural policy.

§ The Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Mr. John Selwyn Gummer)
Under the United Kingdom presidency, the integrated administration and control system was agreed and will be applied in all member states. It is specifically designed to provide effective control of payments flowing from CAP reforms. We make that clear in the accompanying literature both here and elsewhere.

§ Mr. Whittingdale
While I fully support my right hon. Friend's commitment to eradicate CAP fraud and I welcome the contribution that the new integrated administration and control system will make to that, can my right hon. Friend assure me that his Ministry will adopt an understanding and flexible attitude to farmers who are not fraudsters but may have made genuine innocent mistakes in completing their forms?

§ Mr. Gummer
My hon. Friend makes a valid point. On some matters there are Communitywide rules on how we apply the forms. An example is the date on which the forms have to be returned. If the form is a couple of days late, there is a particular penalty. The rules are purposely Europewide to make sure that everyone obeys the rules. However, wherever there is flexibility, we shall use it. I appeal to farmers to tell us in advance if they find that they have made some mistake. Then we shall know that they are not trying to defraud.

§ Rev. Martin Smyth
What lessons have been learnt by the various EC countries with land frontiers which could be useful in dealing with the fraud that has taken place across our land frontiers with the Republic of Ireland?

§ Mr. Gummer
We have learnt several lessons. One of the most important is that we should not start fraud off by paying money to which people are not entitled. Therefore, both the IACS forms and the arrangements for passports and ear-tagging for animals that receive a premium are a basic necessity if we are to save taxpayers' money and ensure that the money goes to the right people.

§ Mrs. Browning
Has my right hon. Friend had a chance to examine the comparable forms which farmers in other EC member countries have to fill in? Will he guarantee to take a watching brief to ensure that the forms are applied universally throughout the Community?

§ Mr. Gummer
I have certainly looked at the forms used by our partners. In almost every case, they have been less 1136 clear and less well laid out than ours. Only the Danes have a shorter form, but that is because they have had much of the material on computer for some time. Our accompanying literature is also much clearer. That is because we bothered to spend time to make sure that farmers made the fewest possible mistakes. I will ensure that the forms are properly filled in other countries.

§ Dr. Strang
Does the Minister accept that fraud involving the common agricultural policy now costs billions of pounds a year? Does he acknowledge that although the IACS forms, if applied effectively throughout the EC, will help to tackle fraud in respect of payments to farmers, they will not deal with the large part of the fraud relating to export refunds? Is it true that some member Governments are concealing information on such fraudulent transactions? Is it not time that the British Government took a decisive stand on the issue and made it clear that they will not agree to any changes in the CAP until fraud is effectively tackled?

§ Mr. Gummer
The British Government's decisive stand has led to a much more fraud-proof operation than we had before. I am grateful for such support as I have received from the Labour party on the issue—at least we all agree that we do not want fraud. The hon. Gentleman somewhat overstates the amount of fraud, but we agree that there is too much—any amount of fraud is too much and we must stop it. We must now proceed to ensure that the reduced amount of export support which comes from the GATT round will give us the opportunity to carry the much more stringent measures into every aspect of the CAP.