§ 9. Mr. CoxTo ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department when he met the chief inspector of prisons to discuss his latest report on prison conditions.
§ Mr. Peter LloydMy right hon. and learned Friend the Home Secretary met the chief inspector for a general discussion on 30 April. I met Judge Tumim on 28 April and again on 7 May, when I attended the inspectorate's training seminar in Eastbourne.
§ Mr. CoxI thank the Minister for that reply. He and his right hon. and learned Friend will be in no doubt about the continuing criticism by the chief inspector of our prisons, the conditions in which many inmates are kept and the sad increase in suicides in prison. Is the hon. Gentleman aware that it is obvious from talking to senior prison governors and prison officers that the root problem in our prisons, as today's exchanges have shown, is gross overcrowding? It is 1029 not building new prisons that will release the tensions and solve the troubles in our prisons. When will this issue be faced up to?
§ Mr. LloydHaving spoken to the chief inspector, I am well aware that he believes that there are many excellent prisons, with good work being done in them. Contrary to what the hon. Gentleman says, the number of suicides has fallen in recent years. Any suicide is one too many, but there are fewer suicides now.
My right hon. and learned Friend referred to the building and refurbishment programmes, which are extensive. I hope that the hon. Gentleman and his hon. Friends will resist those members of the public who object to the building of new prisons in suitable places—as they are naturally inclined to do.