Title (Hansard, 17 October 1990)

§ Lord James Douglas-Hamilton
I beg to move amendment No. 89, in line 15, leave out
'in relation to homelessness due to risk of violence'. This amendment will ensure that the long title more accurately reflects the amendments to the Housing (Scotland) Act 1987 that are included in the Bill.

§ Mr. Dewar
There will be one or two Third Reading speeches, but they will all be marked by their brevity.
I look back with some satisfaction on the Bill, but it will remain something of a curiosity in the annals of Scottish parliamentary procedure. Never were so many columns of Hansard filled in so short a time.
The situation now is rather different, but it is appropriate that for most of this evening the Under-Secretary of State laboured on alone, accompanied only by the Secretary of State. I say entirely appropriate because, in a sense, they were alone for almost the entire Committee stage.
The Under-Secretary of State gets tired of people paying tribute to him, but I must do so on this occasion. He ploughed on with remarkable courage, often sounding like Bertie Wooster, but in a sense as unflappable as Jeeves. Never have I seen briefs put to such determined use when all round him there was chaos and confusion. At times—this is a factual observation—the Committee Room looked like the last act of "The Duchess of Malfi", with bodies everywhere. We saw the decrowning of the chairman of the Scottish Conservative party and we saw blood on every side, but in the middle of it all the Under-Secretary of State kept going, and for that he deserves some credit.
I hope that no one will accuse me of over-complacency, but Opposition Members—I include my friends in other parties, particularly the hon. and learned Member for Fife, North-East (Mr. Campbell) and, an honorary blood brother for this occasion only, the hon. and learned Member for Perth and Kinross (Sir N. Fairbairn), who I believe in the many votes taken in Committee voted for the Government only once, not by mistake but as a matter of principle, and we all allow the hon. and learned Gentleman his occasional aberrations of principle—did good work. I cannot remember any Bill that has left our hands more changed and more lightened. A great deal of rubbish had gone and many good things had been added, for which we can claim some credit.
I also want to thank those from outside this place who helped us. It may not be proper to mention them in detail, but a number of bodies have laboured long and hard, perhaps above all the Law Society. Many others, such as the Scottish Consumer Council, were also involved and their help, although not always uncritically received, was invaluable. Their contribution to the law of Scotland may not be major, but the Bill makes a better contribution to it than it otherwise would have done.
A number of issues of real importance have had to go by the board. I have explained this before, but I stress it again. The Opposition were implacably opposed to what was suggested, but it was impossible in the ludicrous time scale suggested to look at the matters adequately—I am thinking particularly of changes in the divorce laws, licensing laws and some good ideas on reforming fines in the criminal courts, along with a number of other matters. I hope that we will have an opportunity to return to those before too long.
I understand that there is a possibility next Session of legislation on parole. The Under-Secretary of State, probably wisely, remained silent when I said that I hoped that would be a Scottish Bill, not a throwaway Scottish insert in a United Kingdom Criminal Justice Bill. The 1270 Kincraig report contained some serious propositions and I hope that if we are to implement some of them, as we should, we will do so on the basis of Scottish legislation.
Perhaps that would give us an opportunity to return to some of the issues, or perhaps there should be another Law Reform (Miscellaneous Provisions) (Scotland) Bill—I hope that the Secretary of State does not blanch at the thought—before too long. It has all been good fun, and—on a more serious note—rather a useful exercise.

§ Sir Nicholas Fairbairn
The Leader of the House will remember that the late F. E. Smith—late at night and after some appallingly boring and long-drawn-out speeches—was asked to give a vote of thanks. He said "Before I came here I prepared two speeches, one long and one short, and because of the lateness of the hour I intend to give them both." I intend to give neither. All that I want to say is that I hope that our Government and our party will not break the rule that rules should not be multiplied and that legislation of any kind is a bad thing.

§ Mr. Menzies Campbell
When we set out to consider the Bill, few of us realised that it would prove such an effective springboard for the career of Lord Sanderson of Bowden, or that it would have such a dramatic effect on unemployment statistics in the city of Edinburgh. Had we known that those dramas were being enacted as we went through our routine day-by-day examination of its clauses in Committee, it might have added a certain piquancy to our proceedings, and might even have persuaded the press and television to take yet more interest in our efforts to improve the law of Scotland.
One thing is certainly true: putting charities, reform of the legal profession and licensing law reform into a Bill, and then adding what were genuinely miscellaneous provisions, meant that many important issues failed to receive the time and the detailed intellectual consideration that they undoubtedly deserved.
The Under-Secretary of State deserves our congratulations on his indefatigability and his continuing courtesy to all sides. Sometimes it seemed that a greater strain was being put on his courtesy by those behind him than by those who were nominally opposing him. However, he survived.
I look forward with considerable pleasure to accounts of our proceedings as they will appear in biographies which I know are yet to be written. The role that some people played in the proceedings, especially in Committee, will be marked in passages of such colour and verve that they will come to be regarded as significant contributions to English fiction.
No doubt the Bill will pass into law. It contains many good things, but I fear that it also contains a number of bad laws, the lack of quality of which will be properly explored and made clear only when some of the measures that we have passed into law are put into practice. Undoubtedly, it has been a learning experience for all of us. I do not think that anyone will wish to oppose Third Reading at this stage, but it can certainly be said that the Bill is now in rather better condition that it deserved.

§ Mr. Dalyell
As one who has been present for the past two days' debate on the Floor of the House but was not a member of the Committee, I should like to say thank you to my parliamentary colleagues of all parties who have taken part in our discussions, as well as to the officials and to the Law Society of Scotland for having improved, in many respects, the lot of our Scottish constituents.

§ Dr. Godman
This is the second Law Reform (Miscellaneous Provisions) (Scotland) Bill in which I have been involved; I hope that a considerable time will elapse before I am called back by the Whips to take part in a third. I only hope that, if I am placed on the Standing Committee on another Bill in the future, the hon. and learned Member for Perth and Kinross (Sir N. Fairbairn) is also placed on it.
I should like to express my thanks to the Under-Secretary of State for the many civilities and courtesies that he has extended to me, both in Committee and on the Floor of the House. I am heartened by the measures concerning the introduction of closed-circuit television to deal with the evidence given by children in criminal proceedings; however, I am deeply disappointed that the same Minister was unwilling to listen to my argument concerning the use of video-recorded interviews as evidence in criminal proceedings. I fear that, with the advent of the Gracious Speech on 7 November, we will find that we are slipping further behind English legislation in this respect. Nevertheless, with the Under-Secretary's involvement, we have improved the law of Scotland as it affects the interests of young children who are caught up in such horrendous circumstances, and I am grateful to him for that measure at least.

§ Mrs. Margaret Ewing
Those of us who served on the Standing Committee will have many memories that will no doubt be recounted through the ages, not so much because of the contents of the Bill as because of the nature of its passage. The memories include the summoning of members of the Scottish Grand Committee in the Royal High school in Edinburgh to be given talks behind the scenes and long walks up and down the Committee Corridor by the Secretary of State for Scotland and various Ministers with their own Back Benchers. Judging 1272 by the expressions on their faces, the Secretary of State sometimes wished that there was a perpendicular structure at the foot of the passage over which he could tip some of his own Back Benchers.
More seriously, let me say that there have been improvements as a result of the Bill; but the way in which it was treated was, in many ways, an insult to the need for law reform in Scotland. Certainly—as one who sees the institution of the Scottish legal system as a major bastion of Scottish nationhood and as an institution of which we are rightly proud—I hope that any future miscellaneous law reform Bills will be just that, and that we shall be able to look in more detail and more effectively at many of the issues that have been left untouched.
I too thank the Minister for his abiding courtesy throughout the many hours in which we have debated. I also congratulate him on being a member of a team that has at least lived up to one of the Prime Minister's requirements. I refer to her request for a "green" image: what would have been a very large statute has been reduced during our proceedings to a much smaller one.

§ Lord James Douglas-Hamilton
Let me pay tribute to those hon. Members who served on the Committee for more than 80 hours, to the Law Society of Scotland, to the Scottish Consumer Council and other bodies and, of course, to the officials who worked ceaselessly around the clock to ensure that I gave accurate answers to the points raised by Opposition Members. I have no regrets about the considerable number of amendments: I believe that that is parliamentary democracy operating at its best.
Part I of the Bill will help charities by giving them much more information. Part II will help to introduce an element of competition to assist the consumer and will also open up access to the supreme courts for solicitors for the first time in Scottish legal history. Part III will introduce important licensing reforms and stiffen the criteria for late-night extensions, which is a law-and-order measure. Part IV has been discussed extensively today; perhaps the two most important measures concern supervised attendance and video links, which will go a long way towards protecting children.
I thank hon. Members for the part that they have played in the Bill. I believe that it will prove a significant measure for us to look back on in years to come.