HC Deb 17 October 1990 vol 177 cc1273-5

Amendment made, in page 1, line 23, leave out from 'a' to first 'of' in line 7 on page 2 and insert 'person to be included in the registers of parliament and local government electors published for the years beginning with 16th February 1990 and 16th February 1991—

  1. (a) subsections (1) to (3) above shall be deemed to have been in force on 10th October 1989 and 10th October 1990 (the qualifying dates in relation to those registers);
  2. (b) the reference in section 11(2) of the Representation of the People Act 1983 to the correction of a register shall include a reference to any addition made by virtue of this section; and
  3. (c) the relevant provisions'—[Sir Wyn Roberts.]

Bill reported, with an amendment.

6.49 pm
The Minister of State, Welsh Office (Sir Wyn Roberts)

I beg to move, That the Bill be now read the Third time.

In Committee, some concern was expressed about clause 2, and I am happy to inform the House of our decision that the Caldey community should become liable for community charge as from 1 April 1991, and that it should also become liable to non-domestic rates as from the same date.

We have also succeeded in devising a good scheme to provide transitional relief for the community. I believe that, on the whole, the islanders will find the total package quite acceptable. Therefore, I have pleasure in commending the Bill to the House.

6.50 pm
Mr. Ted Rowlands (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney)

I thank the Minister for his courteous response, as always, to the substantial point that we made in Committee about the imposition of poll tax before the Bill could be passed. I do not imagine that the islanders of Caldey will be desperately pleased at having the poll tax imposed on them in any shape or form, but at least we have saved them from being taxed before the relevant legislation could be enacted, for the Minister has now confirmed that the poll tax will not take effect there before next year.

The Minister said that the Government have devised "a good scheme" to provide the equivalent of transitional relief. We have already made the point that some difficulty arises because there is no previous rating base from which to work. However, the Minister seems to have confirmed his promise to do something about transitional relief, so perhaps he will give us an idea of what it will be.

6.51 pm
Sir Wyn Roberts

The scheme that we intend to establish will require the islanders, each year in a four-year transitional period, to pay a fixed percentage of that year's community charge for standard spending—or CCSS. That percentage, which I propose to set at 80 per cent. in 1991–92, will increase over the four-year period so that the islanders will move smoothly into a regime of full charges in 1995–96—the same year that full charges will be payable in the rest of Wales as the general transitional relief scheme comes to an end.

The effect of my proposals into 1991–92 is that, as the Welsh CCSS for next year is £228, the islanders will each pay 80 per cent. of that figure, or £182–and so will in effect receive relief of £46 per head. If the charge actually set is lower than the CCSS, then the islanders will each pay only 80 per cent. of that lower charge. However, if the relevant authorities' spend is such that the charge set exceeds £228, each islander will pay 80 per cent. of the CCSS plus the amount by which the charge set exceeds the CCSS. Therefore, Dyfed county council and South Pembrokeshire district council will want to set their budgets in such a way as to enable the islanders to gain maximum benefit from the scheme that I have described.

Question put, That the Bill be now read the Third time:—

The House divided: Ayes 188, Noes 4.

Division No. 320] [6.52 pm
Abbott, Ms Diane Fairbairn, Sir Nicholas
Alexander, Richard Fallon, Michael
Alison, Rt Hon Michael Favell, Tony
Amess, David Fenner, Dame Peggy
Arbuthnot, James Finsberg, Sir Geoffrey
Arnold, Sir Thomas Fishburn, John Dudley
Ashby, David Fisher, Mark
Aspinwall, Jack Flynn, Paul
Baker, Rt Hon K. (Mole Valley) Fookes, Dame Janet
Baker, Nicholas (Dorset N) Forsyth, Michael (Stirling)
Banks, Tony (Newham NW) Forth, Eric
Beaumont-Dark, Anthony Freeman, Roger
Bellingham, Henry French, Douglas
Bevan, David Gilroy Glyn, Dr Sir Alan
Bidwell, Sydney Godman, Dr Norman A.
Blackburn, Dr John G. Goodhart, Sir Philip
Bonsor, Sir Nicholas Goodlad, Alastair
Boscawen, Hon Robert Goodson-Wickes, Dr Charles
Boswell, Tim Greenway, Harry (Ealing N)
Bottomley, Peter Greenway, John (Ryedale)
Bottomley, Mrs Virginia Griffiths, Peter (Portsmouth N)
Bowden, A (Brighton K'pto'n) Griffiths, Win (Bridgend)
Bowden, Gerald (Dulwich) Grist, Ian
Bowis, John Ground, Patrick
Brazier, Julian Gummer, Rt Hon John Selwyn
Bruce, Ian (Dorset South) Hague, William
Buchanan-Smith, Rt Hon Alick Hanley, Jeremy
Burns, Simon Hargreaves, A. (B'ham H'll Gr')
Burt, Alistair Hargreaves, Ken (Hyndburn)
Butcher, John Harris, David
Butler, Chris Hawkins, Christopher
Campbell, Menzies (Fife NE) Hayhoe, Rt Hon Sir Barney
Campbell-Savours, D. N. Heathcoat-Amory, David
Carlisle, John, (Luton N) Hicks, Mrs Maureen (Wolv' NE)
Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) Hill, James
Carrington, Matthew Hind, Kenneth
Chalker, Rt Hon Mrs Lynda Howard, Rt Hon Michael
Chapman, Sydney Howarth, G. (Cannock & B'wd)
Clark, Sir W. (Croydon S) Howe, Rt Hon Sir Geoffrey
Clarke, Rt Hon K. (Rushcliffe) Howell, Ralph (North Norfolk)
Clarke, Tom (Monklands W) Howells, Geraint
Conway, Derek Hughes, Robert G. (Harrow W)
Coombs, Anthony (Wyre F'rest) Hunt, Sir John (Ravensbourne)
Coombs, Simon (Swindon) Hunter, Andrew
Corbyn, Jeremy Jack, Michael
Cran, James Janman, Tim
Cryer, Bob Jessel, Toby
Curry, David Johnson Smith, Sir Geoffrey
Dalyell, Tam Jones, Gwilym (Cardiff N)
Davies, Q. (Stamf'd & Spald'g) Jones, Robert B (Herts W)
Davis, David (Boothferry) Jopling, Rt Hon Michael
Day, Stephen Kellett-Bowman, Dame Elaine
Dicks, Terry Kilfedder, James
Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James King, Roger (B'ham N'thfield)
Dover, Den King, Rt Hon Tom (Bridgwater)
Dunn, Bob Kirkhope, Timothy
Durant, Tony Knapman, Roger
Knight, Greg (Derby North) Pattie, Rt Hon Sir Geoffrey
Knight, Dame Jill (Edgbaston) Pawsey, James
Lang, Ian Portillo, Michael
Lawrence, Ivan Powell, Ray (Ogmore)
Lee, John (Pendle) Price, Sir David
Leighton, Ron Raison, Rt Hon Timothy
Lennox-Boyd, Hon Mark Renton, Rt Hon Tim
Lightbown, David Rhodes James, Robert
Lilley, Peter Riddick, Graham
Lord, Michael Rifkind, Rt Hon Malcolm
McCartney, Ian Roberts, Sir Wyn (Conwy)
McCrindle, Robert Sackville, Hon Tom
McFall, John Shaw, David (Dover)
MacKay, Andrew (E Berkshire) Shaw, Sir Giles (Pudsey)
McNair-Wilson, Sir Patrick Shelton, Sir William
Madel, David Shepherd, Colin (Hereford)
Malins, Humfrey Sims, Roger
Mans, Keith Skeet, Sir Trevor
Mayhew, Rt Hon Sir Patrick Speller, Tony
Meyer, Sir Anthony Stanbrook, Ivor
Michael, Alun Stern, Michael
Miller, Sir Hal Stewart, Allan (Eastwood)
Mills, Iain Stewart, Andy (Sherwood)
Mitchell, Andrew (Gedling) Strang, Gavin
Moate, Roger Sumberg, David
Monro, Sir Hector Summerson, Hugo
Morrison, Sir Charles Taylor, Teddy (S'end E)
Moss, Malcolm Trotter, Neville
Mudd, David Waldegrave, Rt Hon William
Murphy, Paul Walker, Bill (T'side North)
Nelson, Anthony Wheeler, Sir John
Neubert, Michael Widdecombe, Ann
Nicholson, David (Taunton) Wood, Timothy
Norris, Steve Yeo, Tim
Onslow, Rt Hon Cranley Young, Sir George (Acton)
Oppenheim, Phillip
Paice, James Tellers for the Ayes:
Patnick, Irvine Mr. Neil Hamilton and
Patten, Rt Hon John Mr. John M. Taylor.
Madden, Max
Skinner, Dennis Tellers for the Noes:
Wardell, Gareth (Gower) Mr. Ron Davies and
Wise, Mrs Audrey Mr. Rhodri Morgan.

Bill accordingly read the Third time, and passed.

Mr. Bob Cryer (Bradford, South)

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I wonder if you could confirm that the Caldey Island Bill which has just been given a Third Reading was a Bill to extend the franchise, and some hon. Members were here to vote on it, but it is a matter of regret that the hon. Member for Pembroke (Mr. Bennett)—the area concerned—was apparently unable to make the Lobby in time.

Madam Deputy Speaker (Miss Betty Boothroyd)

As the hon. Member is aware, hon. Members' attendance in the House has nothing whatsoever to do with the Chair.

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