§ 12. Mr. Gerald BowdenTo ask the Secretary of State for the Environment whether he has any plans to meet the chairman of English Heritage to discuss his cathedrals initiative.
§ Mr. Chris PattenLord Montagu has told me that the provision of £11.5 million over the next three years for grants towards repair to cathedrals will enable us to establish the scheme on a really sound footing. My officials are discussing the basis of the new grant scheme with his officials and with the church authorities.
§ Mr. Bowdenrose——
§ Mr. SkinnerOn a point of order, Mr. Speaker. Is it in order for two Tory Members to be running a book?
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. We are dealing with an important issues of English heritage.
§ Mr. BowdenI refer to cathedrals, Mr. Speaker. I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for acknowledging that the repair and maintenance of cathedrals is beyond the resources of cathedral authorities. As those great 573 institutions enjoy affection and respect far beyond merely churchgoers and are monuments to our national heritage, is not there a case for increased public support to ensure that they are maintained properly?
§ Mr. PattenI agree with my hon. Friend. I am sure that it is right that public appeals and private donations will remain the major source of funds for the repair of cathedrals, but it is right also that the state should play a role by using grant to lever in private finance. That is the objective of our new scheme. As I said, we shall be spending £11.5 million on the scheme in the next three years. The scheme has been widely welcomed by churchmen and by others who visit our great church buildings, though I recognise that the repair of cathedrals is not uppermost in everybody's minds this afternoon.
§ Mr. CryerI endorse the view that public money should be spent on those great works of art and great assets for the country at large. Does the Secretary of State agree that, as he has undertaken to endorse the principle that public money should be spent on those great buildings, it would be better to do that and leave market forces to obtain money for Trident, for example? Instead of leaving cathedrals to raise money by flag days, we could use flag days for spending on nuclear weapons. The £9,000 million saved could then be spent on pensions, the national health service and a little bit on cathedrals.
§ Mr. PattenThe hon. Gentleman must have heard the Leader of the Opposition say on a number of occasions that the Labour party now believes in market forces. That is what we are told again and again. The hon. Gentleman must therefore be a continuing embarrassment to those responsible for trying to burnish the image of the Labour party.