HC Deb 19 March 1990 vol 169 cc879-80
15. Mr. Alex Carlile

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement on the levels of community charge declared by local authorities in Wales.

Mr. Peter Walker

It is a matter of concern that some local authorities have chosen to set budgets and hence community charges well above the levels implied by the generous settlement for 1990–91 which I announced to the House in December 1989. Their electorates will judge whether their explanations for any increases which are higher than necessary are acceptable.

Mr. Carlile

Will the right hon. Gentleman join me in congratulating the politically independent Montgomeryshire district council on setting a very low community charge? But what is his comment on the fact that even in Montgomeryshire most people appear to be worse off than they were under the rates, particularly pensioners who will suffer financially and who are confused by the bureaucracy introduced by the charge?

Mr. Walker

Although there may be some initial difficulties, pensioners in receipt only of their pensions and income supplements will, without exception, be better off than they were under the rating system. There are 300,000 such people in Wales, and they will benefit because the total amount of rebate and allowances will be more than the total poll charge.

Secondly, looking at the overall figures in Wales we should recognise that if these increases in expenditure had taken place under the old rating system, domestic rates would be rising by 30 per cent. this year.

Mr. Morgan

As this may be the right hon. Gentleman's last appearance at the Dispatch Box as Secretary of State for Wales, and as he has walked out on Slater Walker and is now walking out on Thatcher Walker—I do not know what he has against the roofing trade—can he say whether the last thing that he will do as Secretary of State will be to rate-cap authorities such as Cardiff or South Glamorgan which, after all, have set a poll tax exactly in line with what the city treasurer of Cardiff city council predicted last year? He is not a political official but a neutral financial official who made his calculations as soon as he was told what the Government grant would be.

Mr. Walker

It is interesting that a Labour county council and district council made a prediction before they knew any of the figures, including the grants to be provided by Government. They came up with a figure and stuck to it, and I think that there is a great deal of party politics involved.