Points of Order (Hansard, 19 June 1990)

§ Mr. David Nicholson (Taunton)
On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. Have you had an application from the Government to make a statement on the success of our co-ordination with the Italian police in Sardinia, especially as this House appears to have had two not very near misses from one of the British soccer hooligans in Sardinia?

§ Mr. Speaker
I have not had such an application.

§ Mr. Jeremy Corbyn (Islington, North)
On a point of order, Mr. Speaker.

§ Mr. Speaker
The hon. Gentleman has a ten-minute rule motion. However, I call him.

§ Mr. Corbyn
During defence questions, the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth (Mr. Dickens) chose to claim, wrongly, that I had left the Chamber before my hon. Friend the Member for Islington, South and Finsbury (Mr. Smith) raised a point of order last Monday and that I returned to the Chamber later. He was trying to suggest that by some means I was avoiding being here. I left the Chamber at 3.10 pm last Monday because I had another appointment to which to go. I then went to my constituency and did not return to the House for the whole day. In the circumstances, would you, Mr. Speaker, ask the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth to apologise for his attempt to mislead and misinform the House?

§ Mr. Speaker
I have already said that the hon. Gentleman must take responsibility for exciting interest in the reasons why hon. Members may leave the Chamber. Such questions, which make allegations, are not helpful to good relations in this Chamber. Does the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth (Mr. Dickens) want to say anything about that?

§ Mr. Geoffrey Dickens (Littleborough and Saddleworth)
Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. The hon. Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn) left the Chamber just before the announcement at 3.30 pm. I simply asked the Minister, therefore, a question of fact. You did not allow my question to be answered, Mr. Speaker, and I stand by what I said.

§ Mr. Martin Flannery (Sheffield, Hillsborough)
In view of the fact that the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth (Mr. Dickens) has told an untruth and will not withdraw it, will you, Mr. Speaker, go through the proper procedure with him?

§ Mr. Speaker
The hon. Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn) has already stated why he left the Chamber. It is not for me to interpret what was in the mind of the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth in drawing attention to it.

§ Mr. Stuart Bell (Middlesbrough)
On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. The hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth (Mr. Dickens) clearly made an unparliamen-tary remark in relation to my hon. Friend the Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn). Without in any way challenging your ruling, Mr. Speaker, it must be appropriate to ask the hon. Gentleman to withdraw his remark.

§ Mr. Speaker
I have already given the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth that opportunity. The hon. Member for Islington, North stated the reasons why he left the Chamber, and that should be good enough for the House.

§ Mr. Richard Holt (Langbaurgh)
On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. A problem to which I have drawn your attention on many occasions is the inconsistency in the way in which points of order can be raised. Historically, you have said when people have tried to raise points of order during Question Time that you will not accept them. Equally, when points of order have been raised immediately after questions and there is a ten-minute rule Bill, you have refused to take them. Why is it that Labour Members are allowed to raise points of order, whereas we are not?

§ Mr. Speaker
The hon. Member for Langbaurgh (Mr. Holt) has a very short memory. He should read Hansard. In 1987 I gave a measured ruling—[Interruption.] I gave a full ruling on the timing of points of order. I draw the hon. Gentleman's attention to column 459 on 12 February. I suggest he should read it.

§ Mr. Chris Smith (Islington, South and Finsbury)
Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. I am sure that you and the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth (Mr. Dickens) are aware that my hon. Friend the Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn), throughout our responses to the horrifying explosion in my constituency a week ago, has given complete support to me in expressing the horror that we all feel about that explosion. It would be wrong for any hon. Member to suggest anything else.

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. I think we have had enough of this. Let me repeat what I have already said on this matter. It does not help if questions of that kind, which cast aspersions on the motives of an hon. Member, are thrown accross the Chamber. It does not add anything to our debate. It does not go down well in the Chamber and I regret that it was done.

§ Mr. John P. Smith (Vale of Glamorgan)
Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. I apologise, but this matter should be pursued. I was present when the remarks were made by the hon. Gentleman. He said that my hon. Friend the Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn) did not simply leave the Chamber but that he left the Chamber and came back. That is not right.

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. This is only taking time out of a very important debate, on which in any event I shall now have to place the 10-minute limit. It is frequently the same hon. Members who are not interested in taking part in debates who are trying to steal prime time. We have a very important debate today. I can add nothing to what I have said. The hon. Member for Islington, North (Mr. Corbyn) has clearly stated why he left the Chamber. I say again that that should be good enough for the House.

§ Mrs. Alice Mahon (Halifax)
Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. May I say, in as unsophisticated a way as possible, that it would appear to the House and anybody watching the proceedings that the hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth (Mr. Dickens) lied.

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. The hon. Member for Littleborough and Saddleworth (Mr. Dickens) has put forward his interpretation of what he said, but I repeat that it adds nothing to the quality of our debate. I am equally sure that comments and aspersions of that kind do not go down well in anybody's constituency.

§ Mr. Andrew Faulds (Warley, East)
rose—

§ Mr. Speaker
Oh, God. I suppose that it will be helpful. Come on.

§ Mr. Faulds
I am most grateful, Sir, that you should call for such aid when I appear. Most of us in this House deserve to be referred to as honourable gentlemen. Would not it be fitting if the hon. Member for Littleborough and wherever pretended to be one for three minutes?

§ Mr. Speaker
I have already made my views plain on that point.