HC Deb 12 June 1989 vol 154 cc539-40
3. Mr. Tony Banks

To ask the Secretary of State for Transport if he will make a further statement about ticket barriers on the London Underground system.

The Minister for Public Transport (Mr. Michael Portillo)

I understand that a report from the independent consultants on the working of the Underground ticketing system is expected shortly.

Mr. Banks

Will the young and up-and-coming Minister please explain to me how London Underground Limited can carry on installing ticket gates when virtually no one in London approves of them? Has the hon. Gentleman seen the chaos at, for example, Westminster Underground station, where the authorities have to lock the gates open because of the pressure of people? Will he please call in London Underground to tell it to stop this ridiculous scheme which, I remind him, would never have been allowed under the good old GLC?

Mr. Portillo

I have considered the problems of congestion in a number of our stations. I do not think that the ticketing system is the main contributor. There are other reasons for the congestion. The railway inspectorate and the fire brigade have looked at the gates. We have asked consultants to look at them, and their report will be available shortly. The hon. Gentleman often urges us to adopt the systems that operate abroad. I point out that gates at exits are to be found in Hong Kong, Singapore, Washington, San Francisco, Seoul, Philadelphia, Illinois, Tokyo, Osaka and on the Paris RER.

Mr. Harry Greenway

Will my hon. Friend undertake not to return to the old days of the GLC, which doubled the fares and doubled the rates in 1981? Will he give Londoners an assurance on the effect of these gates in a fire?

Mr. Portillo

That has been the subject of the study by the railway inspectorate and the London fire brigade. Emergency buttons are positioned in various places where the staff can operate them, so that all the gates fly open. Recently, the Underground has checked that in the event of a power failure—even a single-phase power failure—the gates would open automatically. That is the basis on which the railway inspectorate and the London fire brigade have felt confident in approving those systems.

Mrs. Clwyd

Will the Minister look a the chaos that all too frequently occurs at Gatwick airport, where passengers from airlines find it almost impossible to purchase a ticket? Is the Minister aware that late at night, only one window out of eight—

Mr. Speaker

Does the hon. Lady mean Gatwick underground?

Mrs. Clwyd

I am talking about passengers attempting to get on to the Underground from the airlines.

Mr. Speaker

Order. This is very wide of the question.