HC Deb 18 July 1988 vol 137 cc774-5
7. Mr. Martyn Jones

To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if he will make a statement on Her Majesty's Government's proposals for private management of sports grounds, leisure and recreation facilities, in so far as they affect (a) Clwyd and (b) Wales.

Mr. Grist

I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave to my hon. Friend the Member for Pembroke (Mr. Bennett) on 1 July.

Mr. Jones

I thank the Minister for that helpful answer. Is he aware that the average deficit for a swimming pool in the Principality is £200,000? Attempting to make a profit in those circumstances is likely to mean having to cut staff or otherwise risk the safety of the pool's users. Has the Minister taken that into account?

Mr. Grist

Certainly. All safety measures will have to be maintained by anyone who takes on a contract to run a swimming pool. That is absolute an in law.

Sir Anthony Meyer

Will my hon. Friend watch the position with some care? Is he aware that there is legitimate concern in many quarters about the possible consequences of privatising the sports centres, which could result in the introduction of fruit machines and other such undesirable intrusions into what should be a public amenity?

Mr. Grist

My hon. Friend will be pleased to learn that the management of these facilities will be under the control of the local authorities. People have not understood that, for instance, pricing and admission policies will also be something that the local authorities can lay down at the outset.

Mr. Alan Williams

Does the Minister recognise that we are probably unanimous in the House in our deep concern at the exessive drinking, drug taking, vandalism and hooliganism among the young? Does he agree that there are enormous social gains to be made if, by providing positive activities for the young, we can reduce any of those crucial problems?

Does the Minister accept in this context that merely fiddling with the management of existing facilities is irrelevant to, and a diversion from, the real problem, which is the need to provide more resources and facilities that are directly relevant to the needs of the young? What meaningful proposals has he to make?

Mr. Grist

I should have thought that the hon. Gentleman would notice, for instance, the sprouting around Wales of enormous numbers of leisure centres, which are a very new development. They will remain available, and the pricing and admission policies will remain in the hands of the local authorities when they lay down the contracts. Those who run such facilities will have an absolute incentive to persuade as many people as possible to take advantage of them, whereas at present they have no such incentive.

Forward to