Hospitals (Hansard, 18 July 1988)

5. Mr. Alan W. Williams
To ask the Secretary of State for Wales how many hospitals in Wales have (a) been closed and (b) been opened since 1979; and what is the net loss of hospital beds in that period.

§ Mr. Grist
Twenty-three National Health Service hospitals in Wales closed between 1 January 1979 and 31 December 1987 and nine opened. The net loss of hospital beds in that period was 2,544, of which almost two thirds—1,690—were for people with a mental handicap or mental illness, in line with our policy that services should be developed in the community so that such people may lead as normal a life as possible.

Mr. Williams
Is the Minister not ashamed of those figures, of 2,500 beds lost, and of fewer hospital beds in Wales today than when the National Health Service was formed in 1947? May I ask him about Mynydd Mawr hospital, which is just outside my constituency? Part of East Dyfed health authority's proposals for modernising Llanelli hospital include closing Mynydd Mawr hospital, with a loss of 58 beds for elderly people. Does the Minister not realise that cottage hospitals are much needed and wanted? Why is it that when it comes to hospital modernisation, the Government are willing to put up with certain losses of hospital beds?

§ Mr. Grist
The hon. Gentleman will know that the proposal he mentioned is purely the responsibility of the local health authority at the moment, which sees it in connection with the proposed expansion of phase 2 of the new Llanelli hospital. Clearly, that is not something on which I can comment at present. As to the first part of the hon. Gentleman's question, since 1967—for the past 20 years—there has been a fall in the number of staffed beds in Wales, as the policy of closing beds to keep people in the community has been common to both sides of the House.

Mrs. Clywd
Does the Minister not realise that the nine area health authorities have already said that if he is unable to fund the nurses' pay award in full they will be between £8 million and £10 million short? Where does the Minister expect them to find that money? Where are they to get it? Will that shortfall mean further ward closures and longer waiting lists? Will he tell the House?

§ Mr. Grist
The hon. Lady mistook what I first said. I said nothing to the effect that we are not going to fund the nurses' pay award.

§ Mr. Rowlands
Is the Minister aware that there are 580 people waiting for ENT operations in Prince Charles hospital, Merthyr, alone, and that 80 per cent. of them are children? Is he aware of the distress caused to both children and their parents, who are now being driven to pay for private treatment—often to the consultants who are at the hospital? Does he not think that that is scandalous? Is it not time that he took action?

§ Mr. Grist
If the hon. Gentleman is speaking of his own particular hospital, he will be aware that matters there are under investigation by the hospital's own authorities. My Department is keeping a close eye on those investigations.

§ Sir Raymond Gower
Is it not a fact that, as I have said on a number of occasions, each advance in medical science may increase the length of some waiting lists by enhancing the demand?

§ Mr. Grist
That is true. Fifteen years ago one would not have had a waiting list for hip operations, because the operating method was unknown them.