HC Deb 13 January 1987 vol 108 c129
2. Mrs. Clwyd

asked the Secretary of State for Social Services from which organisations representations were received asking him to simplify the payment of statutory sick pay.

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health and Social Security (Mr. Nicholas Lyell)

Representations have been received from both sides of industry for changes and simplification of the statutory sick pay scheme. They include among employers' organisations the CBI, the Engineering Employers Federation, the National Federation of Self Employed and Small Businesses, the Pay-roll Alliance and the Association of Independent Businesses, and for employees' and consumer organisations, the TUC, the National Association of Citizens Advice Bureaux and the Disability Alliance.

Mrs. Clwyd

Is the real reason for cutting out the middle rate of statutory sick pay not simplification, as the Minister said, but savings of £19 million, which yet again have been made at the expense of the sick?

Mr. Lyell

No. Eighty-five per cent. will receive the standard, which is the higher rate. It does not make sense to have two rates. It is true that there are savings of £19 million—against a background of nearly £750 million—but they will not all be at the expense of the sick because, as the hon. Lady knows, a very high proportion belong to occupational schemes.

Mrs. Beckett

Surely my hon. Friend the Member for Cynon Valley (Mrs. Clwyd) is correct. What the Minister has said today is wholly contrary to what was said by his Department less than a year ago when it claimed that the system was extremely simple and was working very well. Is not the only explanation the combination of the savings and the Government's desire to placate employers by this change while at the same time introducing statutory maternity pay, which neither employers nor mothers want?

Mr. Lyell

That is not correct. The system is working well now. There have been strong requests for simplification, not just by employers. The increase in the lower rate will benefit those who receive statutory maternity pay.