Food Aid (Hansard, 19 February 1987)

§ 8. Mr. Dixon
asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food what are the latest amounts of (a) butter and (b) meat distributed in the United Kingdom under the European Economic Community food aid scheme.

§ Mr. Gummer
Releases authorised so far from intervention stores in the United Kingdom represent 15 million packs of butter and 3.15 million portions of beef.

§ Mr. Dixon
Has the Minister had any report of local difficulties in the uptake of the scheme? There have been reports of all sorts of problems in the distribution of this food. That is not the fault of the charities involved, because they were given little notice, no information and no resources to carry out the organisation of the scheme. If those reports are true, will the Minister ensure that those for whom the food is meant receive it?

§ Mr. Gummer
Charities have welcomed what we have done. The release of stocks was indeed done rapidly, but the cold weather occurred and we wanted to do it as quickly as possible. If we had done it at length, I am sure that the Opposition would have complained had the butter gone out in June. We tried to send the food off as quickly as possible. There are places in which distribution has been better than in others because some charities have been better organised in some places than others. We are trying to help in every way possible. It is a remarkable fact that Britain got off the ground first. We have distributed more than any other country in Europe and have done it more efficiently. Our charities are better run.

§ Mr. Burt
I thank my right hon. Friend for his comments about the charities involved. Will he spare a moment to thank the charities for the excellent work that they have done in distributing the food? If it becomes clear that we have not been able to distribute as much as we would like, will my right hon. Friend, in company with his colleagues in Europe, consider extending the deadline so that more of the stock can be distributed to those who need it?

§ Mr. Gummer
I cannot give agreement to that at this stage. We are monitoring the position extremely carefully because we want to see how efficient it is. I am impressed by the charities. I commend particularly the Salvation Army and the Womens Royal Voluntary Service for their work. I am also pleased to see the support that the butchery trade has given to the charities to help with the cutting up of the meat.

§ Mr. Hugh Brown
I recognise that the Department is monitoring the scheme, but what steps have the right hon. Gentleman or the Secretary of State for Scotland taken to put Members of Parliament in the picture about what quantity of food can be expected in any geographical area, if not in any constituency? Has the right hon. Gentleman given guidelines to the voluntary bodies on that?

§ Mr. Gummer
I distributed a note to all Members of Parliament saying which charities were working in this matter and how the system would work. I advised all Members of Parliament to get in touch with me if there were any particular problems. If the note has not reached them, it is because it has not come from their Whips' office. The note was provided, and if there were any particular problems, I asked for hon. Members to get in touch with my office. My office has dealt with any Member of Parliament who wanted help, and I am happy to speak on any detail about which an hon. Member is concerned. The charities have been given general guidelines. I have left it to them to do what they do best, which is to go to the people whom they know in the way that they find most effective.

§ Mr. Colvin
Will my right hon. Friend add Age Concern to the list of charities to be congratulated, because, along with the WRVS, it has done a lot of work in my area? Will he also have words at an early date with his friends in the Department of Health and Social Security? I feel that greater liaison between his Ministry and the DHSS is important if we are to get over to people in need the message as to who qualifies for this food. Currently, there is a slight breakdown in communications.

§ Mr. Gummer
I commended those two charities because the others which have helped us so much centrally, as well as other smaller charities, have relied on them to a great extent. I add the Red Cross to the list of charities which have done a lot of work for other charities. I am not underestimating the work done by the other charities which have been co-operating.
I warn my hon. Friend about his comment with regard to the DHSS. We tried to operate a scheme in Europe which enabled the food to go through the charities that had a regular, continuing relationship with those most in need so that we did not have a bureaucratic system which involved saying, "You get it only if you fit into a particular situation. There is that token. You must wait in line." We want a freer system which operates under the guidelines that we have given. That is why we have kept this operation in the voluntary sector. That is the right way to to it.

§ Mr. Corbett
Is the Minister aware that until about a week or 10 days ago not a single slice of beef and very little butter had been distributed in Birmingham and the rest of the west midlands? Will the right hon. Gentleman take steps to ensure that if extra assistance to the charities involved in the scheme in Birmingham and the west midlands is needed his Ministry will provide it?

§ Mr. Gummer
The hon. Gentleman may be a little behind the times. I was in the west midlands yesterclay, where I helped to distribute the butter which was part of the 5 tonnes of butter going to Wolverhampton alone. The hon. Gentleman has probably got it wrong. If there is a difficulty, I shall certainly look into it for him.

§ Mr. Cormack
Is my right hon. Friend aware that, commendable as the scheme is, the amount of food involved is very small? I hope that my right hon. Friend the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food is not today negotiating away large surplus amounts to the Russians at knock-down prices.

§ Mr. Gummer
I think that 15 million packs of butter is quite a lot of butter—we should not be curmudgeonly about the amount of food that is going out in this way — but the scheme will not solve the problems that we have had with stocks. We have sought to stop the stocks from growing. A decision to that effect was the successful outcome of our negotiations in December. We still have to get rid of a very large quantity of butter, some of which is not comparatively new butter—such as the butter to which we are referring—but has been there for some time. I certainly do not rule out the opportunities to sell that butter in other markets.

§ Mr. John
As, by common consent, the right hon. Gentleman and all of us are grateful to the charities for their work, will he set their minds at rest by clarifying at whose cost the meat and butter are to be distributed? The 1051 Government are paying for the cost of inward distribution, but will the charities have to bear the fuel costs of their distribution of the butchered or packaged foods?

§ Mr. Gummer
We discussed in great detail with the charities what the Commission allows in terms of costs. We have gone back to the Commission to suggest that some improvements can be made. I hope that we shall be able to make them. We have a fixed amount for the distribution costs of butter and beef. We are, of course, paying for the cost of buying the milk and cheese at the most suitable market for the charities. We are trying to meet the costs as much as possible. We are discussing with the charities whether they can give any other help. Considerable public funds have been made available for this project, and I think that that is a very satisfactory answer.

§ Mr. Charles Morrison
Does my hon. Friend agree that, on the whole, the distribution of surplus food is working well? However, some of the charities and some of the people working for them are a little nervous about the fact that they might be acting in breach of the regulations. Does my right hon. Friend agree that in marginal situations it is better that the charities should err on the side of generosity rather than on the side of bureaucracy?

§ Mr. Gummer
The Commission made it very clear in launching what was, by its nature, a rapid scheme that it would look with that attitude in mind at the way in which the scheme was carried out. That is a sensible approach. Of course, I am willing and happy to discuss the scheme with any charity which is concerned about how to interpret the guidelines and the Commission's proposals.