HC Deb 11 February 1987 vol 110 cc299-302
6. Mr. John Mark Taylor

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he will take steps to ensure that the Forestry Commission acts upon the conclusions of the National Audit Office regarding the marginal cost-effectiveness of planting conifers on high ground in the north of Scotland, by switching its emphasis to broadleaf plantings in agricultural land further south; and if he will make a statement.

Mr. John MacKay

The National Audit Office review of Forestry Commission objectives and achievements is being considered by the Public Accounts Committee, which will report to Parliament in due course. My right hon. and learned Friend is therefore not at present in a position to make any detailed statement.

Mr. Taylor

I note that reply, but does not my hon. Friend agree that it is, in any event, a virtue to plant woodlands on less productive farmland, or even to develop golf courses there? Would that not lend a new meaning to green keeping? Does that not help to sustain the rural character of that land and a habitat for wildlife?

Mr. MacKay

I completely agree with my hon. Friend. It is important that against the background of surplus agricultural production we look at all the means of maintaining economic activity and rural life in our countryside. That is what my right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food had in mind when he made his statement on Monday in the House.

Sir Hector Monro

Does my hon. Friend agree that the initiative taken by my right hon. and learned Friend the Secretary of State for Scotland and my right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food this week to help promote the rural economy is extremely good news? Does he accept that if we are to increase broadleaved planting, as opposed to conifers, there must be an extra incentive but, at the same time, does he also accept that if we are to encourage tourism in Scotland we must be careful about blanket coniferous planting throughout the scenic areas?

Mr. MacKay

I thank my hon. Friend for his support for our policy. He will recall that the policy statement that we made as far back as July 1985, which introduced the broadleaved woodland grant scheme, was widely welcomed, and the Forestry Commission tells me that the scheme has got off to an encouraging start. My hon. Friend makes a valid point, which everyone who is interested in the countryside and in the forestry industry fully appreciates, that we need to look at both conifers and broadleaved trees as the way forward for the forestry industry and the countryside.

Mr. Lambie

Is the Minister aware that the decision by Caledonian Papers to build a paper mill in Irvine in my constituency, which is an inward investment of £250 million and will involve up to 1,500 jobs during the construction period, and 900 permanent jobs, depends on adequate supplies of timber from the public and private sectors in Scotland? Will the Minister give encouragement to the Forestry Commission to extend its activities in the highlands and southern uplands of Scotland to ensure the continuation of those timber supplies in the future?

Mr. MacKay

The hon. Gentleman shows a realistic appreciation of the importance of forestry for Scotland. I only wish that it was shared by a few other Labour Members. I add to the hon. Gentleman's valid point about the importance of this development in job terms. The plant at Irvine will require sitka spruce, which is often a species much maligned by the environmental conservation lobby. That is the species that the industry wants. It is because of that species that the company is coming to Scotland and to Irvine.

Mr. Pollock

Will my hon. Friend confirm that he recently visited the plant of Highland Forest Products near Inverness? Does he agree that that is a welcome addition, in a modern framework, to the forestry enterprise, substantially relying as it does on locally grown products and bringing a welcome infusion of new jobs to the area'? In short, is that not the sort of development in rural areas that we wish to encourage, and will the Scottish Office do precisely that?

Mr. MacKay

I am happy to respond positively to my hon. Friend, just as I did to the hon. Member for Cunninghame, South (Mr. Lambie). Highland Forest Products has a factory employing about 100 people in the plant and about 300 to 400 people throughout the countryside in the north-east of Scotland. Once again, the plant requires pine trees, the coniferous trees that some of the critics rail against so much. Again, that underlines the point that we need these trees if we are to have a proper forest industry.

Mr. Hardy

Given the enormous dependency on imported timber products and the hugh cereal surpluses that the Government will fail to tackle by their recently announced policy, is it not desirable to transfer some of the rich grade 1 and grade 2 low level arable areas in England to forestry purposes to meet the need—

Mr. Speaker

Order. This question is about Scotland.

Mr. Hardy

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker

This question is about Scotland.

Mr. Hardy

No, forestry.

Mr. Speaker

No, it is about Scotland.

Mr. Corrie

I support what the hon. Member for Cunninghame, South (Mr. Lambie) has said. Could not many areas in Scotland be planted with coniferous trees without spoiling the environment? I support any move to put in hardwood trees, but if land is set aside for such trees, should not agriculture have some compensation for the output of that land?

Mr. MacKay

I agree with my hon. Friend, who has a major constituency interest in the plant at Irvine. I also agree about the need for a balance between broadleaf and conifer. It is important that farmers take advantage of the scheme announced on Monday to plant conifers and deciduous trees in land, which, up to now, has not been considered for tree planting.

Mr. Kirkwood

Will the Minister give us an assurance that the changes announced this week by the Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food in England will not prejudice the Scottish Office's lead on forestry'? Will he also give us an assurance that the Forestry Commission will play an integral part in the expansion of forestry and that the Government's plans to privatise have been shelved for ever?

Mr. MacKay

I assure the hon. Gentleman that the Scottish Office will continue to play the lead role in forestry. The Forestry Commission has an important role to play. It will be called upon to administer the farm forestry scheme, as it does the scheme on private planting, and its important role in the forestry industry has greatly helped projects such as Kaukas and Highland Forest Products get off the ground in Scotland.

Mr. Michael Forsyth

I congratulate my hon. Friend on the announcement made earlier this week, which will help ordinary farmers, as opposed to pop stars, to plant woodlands. Will he confirm that the cost to public funds of the 40 jobs created by Fountain Forestry in the flow country is in excess of £300,000 per job? Is this a useful way to use public money, especially when more jobs could be created elsewhere from the same resources?

Mr. MacKay

I am afraid that my hon. Friend will have to put down a specific question before I can answer about the exact figure that he mentions. I believe that there is room for both forestry and the open land for which many of the environmentalists and conservationists ask. The committee that we have set up in the Scottish Office to look into the interaction between wildlife and planting in the north of Scotland will help us to find a reasonable solution that will be in the interest of the countryside in that part of Scotland.

Mr. Home Robertson

Is the Minister aware that one of the many clangers dropped by the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food came when he said: The growing of trees under these proposals will be much more attractive to people in the marginal areas".—[Official Report, 9 February 1987; Vol. 110, c. 72.] This must point to more blanket afforestation in the Highlands. If the Minister hopes to curtail the surplus agricultural produce and protect the rural environment, will he take this opportunity to explain how he expects the Forestry Commission or the private sector to achieve an appropriate increase in tree planting on the low ground?

Mr. MacKay

One of the ways in which that can be achieved is to act on the decision that was announced a few months ago that we would take a more relaxed view to planting on land further down the hill. That view has been made perfectly clear to the forestry industry.

Mr. Home Robertson

That is not economic.

Mr. MacKay

I do not agree with the comments made from a sedentary position by the hon. Member for East Lothian (Mr. Home Robertson). Both large-scale forestry— I prefer to use that phrase rather than blanket-forestry—and farm forestry have an important role to play. I would have preferred to hear from the hon. Gentleman that he supported the development of the forestry industry and the jobs that are coming to Scotland as a result.

Mr. Bill Walker

Does my hon. Friend agree that the hundreds of square miles of forestry in my constituency contribute handsomely to the local economy? Does he further agree that it is important that a balance is retained between the needs of tourism and forestry and that that balance has been substantially retained in many areas? Does he accept that the welcome given by the vice-president of the National Farmers Union of Scotland to the Government's proposals show that we are moving along the right lines?

Mr. MacKay

I can certainly confirm to my hon. Friend that the National Farmers Union of Scotland has made a positive response to the statement made by my right hon. Friend last Monday. The Scottish Farmers Union has warmly welcomed the statement, and Opposition Members would be well advised to heed its words. My hon. Friend is equally correct when he said that we have to strike a sensible balance between planting and the needs of conservation interests and the needs of tourism. That can be achieved, and in many parts of Scotland, including the area that I represent, that has been achieved.