§ 3. Mr. Bruceasked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what representations he has received from police authorities for increased manning.
§ Mr. BrittanSix police authorities in England and Wales have applied for increases totalling 52 posts in their police establishments for the financial year 1984–85. I shall shortly be considering these applications in the light of advice from Her Majesty's inspectors of constabulary, together with applications outstanding from four other police authorities for the current financial year.
§ Mr. BruceDoes the Minister acknowledge that, given that the Government are allocating more money to deal with law and order, priority should be given to putting more policemen on the beat and in the community, rather than taking additional powers for the police which undermine individual liberties? Will the Minister acknowledge that my police authority in Grampian has requested an increase of 85 extra policemen, but has been allocated only 15 this year and 15 next?
§ Mr. BrittanI have no responsibility for policing in Scotland, but I understand from the Scottish Home and Health Department that in Scotland, for the period in question, the increase in police strength has been 1,756, with an increase in full-time civilians of 517, and of part-time civilians of 192. That is the equivalent period that was dealt with in the answer on 5 March in relation to England and Wales. I entirely agree that it is not just a question of police numbers. It is absolutely right and necessary to establish clearly what police powers are, and what safeguards there are for them, and that is exactly what is being done in England and Wales in the Police and Criminal Evidence Bill.
§ Mr. Andrew MacKayAs detection is acknowledged as the best form of deterrent, does my right hon. and learned Friend agree that, notwithstanding his helpful offer of an extra 100 policemen in Thames valley at the end of last year, we still have almost the worst police-to-public ratio, and that we need more assistance?
§ Mr. BrittanI hear what my hon. Friend says, but I think he will agree that the increase in the police establishment that I was able to announce has been widely welcomed in the area concerned.
§ Mr. FryMay I remind my right hon. and learned Friend that one of the applications that he will receive is from Northamptonshire? The application is especially important, as the county has undertaken a major reorganisation of policing, and has completed the first part of that, but the success of the consequent reorganisation will depend upon a favourable reply from my right hon. 492 and learned Friend. As this reorganisation will put many more policemen on the beat, deterring crime, will he please favourably consider the county's application?
§ Mr. BrittanI am grateful to my hon. Friend for giving the basis for the application, and I assure him that I will consider his points very carefully.
§ Mr. DubsWill the Home Secretary acknowledge that hundreds of police officers are involved in keeping prisoners in police and court cells in London and southeast England, and this despite his firm commitment to clear those cells by the beginning of the year? Was it not cynical of him to stick by that commitment for two or three days only before the prisoners were back in those court cells? They now number 200 or so every night.
§ Mr. BrittanThe hon. Gentleman is being less than his customary fair self, because if he had followed what was clearly said, he would have known perfectly well that I indicated, at the time of announcing that that commitment was fulfilled, that I was anticipating that there would be a period of difficulty in the first part of the year, pending the coming into availability of fresh prison accommodation. The fact is that the numbers in police cells are massively down compared with last year as a result of the reorganisation in the prison department. They did reach the figure that I specified at the time, and the problem that has arisen since is exactly in accordance with what I anticipated.