HC Deb 26 July 1984 vol 64 cc1227-8
9. Mr. Andrew MacKay

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a further statement on the progress of the negotiations between himself and the political parties after the New Ireland Forum report.

10 Sir John Biggs-Davison

asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what constitutional changes he intends to make in Northern Ireland.

Mr. Prior

During the past three weeks I have had informal discussion with the leaders of the main political parties. I hope for further informal discussion, directly between the parties and with me, during the coming weeks, to see whether common ground can be found on the best way of making political progress in Northern Ireland. The Government hope that it will be possible to develop agreed ideas which reflect the interest and concern of both parts of the community.

Mr. MacKay

Does my right hon. Friend believe that the alliance proposals for more power for the Chairman of the Assembly and for some sharing of the chairmanship across the community divide constitute a useful way forward?

Mr. Prior

Yes. I think that the alliance proposal has a good deal of merit. I have no doubt that it will put them forward in the Reports Committee of the Assembly, with which I shall be having a discussion early next week.

Sir John Biggs-Davison

While paying tribute, on this afternoon of encomia, to my right hon. Friend's desire and efforts to make Northern Ireland more democratic, may I ask him whether he intends to discuss with the Constitutional Committee of the Northern Ireland Assembly, or with anyone else, "the way forward" set out in the document so entitled?

Mr. Skinner

He is on his way out.

Mr. Prior

Of course, I am willing to discuss the proposals in that document at any time. They are an advance on anything that we have seen for some time. The leader of the Official Unionist party knows that.

I may be on my way out, but I shall do my damnedest to see that the hon. Member for Bolsover (Mr. Skinner) is never on the way in.

Mr. McNamara

Why does the right hon. Gentleman always engage in wishful thinking? Why is he so happy to be going? Is it because he has made no real constitutional advance in Northern Ireland, so that we still have a gerrymandered state bearing no resemblance to any ideas of democracy as we understand it in the United Kingdom? Does he agree that the real progress that we need to make will be made not in the Assembly but in discussions with the Republican Government?

Mr. Prior

All Secretaries of State, on both sides of the House, have done their best to make political progress in Northern Ireland, and that must involve both parts of the community. That is our aim, and that is what I have sought to achieve.

Mr. Thurnham

Does my right hon. Friend think that it would be a fitting memorial for his work in Northern Ireland if he built a causeway linking Northern Ireland to the mainland of Britain, thus providing an irrevocable link?

Mr. Prior

We are just completing the Foyle bridge, which has cost a lot of money and I do not think that we have enough for a causeway quite yet.

Mr. Stephen Ross

May I suggest that if the Secretary of State has such powers, he may wish to build us a bridge to the Isle of Wight? May I also suggest that the greatest gift that he could make to this country and to its future peace would be to achieve a power-sharing executive out of the Assembly? Can he say whether, following the discussions that he has had so far with the other parties in Northern Ireland, he is at all optimistic that that is achievable?

Mr. Prior

I think that progress towards any devolved administration involving both parts of the community will be slow. I also think that any form of power sharing must not come under such great pressure that it breaks down again as it did before. We must therefore look for other modes than simply the power sharing of 1973–74. I am trying to turn the attention of the parties in Northern Ireland towards that, to see whether there is an alternative that meets the criteria.

Sir Anthony Grant

Has my right hon. Friend noticed any change in the Irish Government's view on this subject since their ambassador told some of us at the time of the last debate that the Irish Government were reasonably satisfied with the progress being made?

Mr. Prior

No. I think that the view of the Irish Government remains that which the ambassador told my hon. Friend. I must say to the Irish Government, and to this House, that I do not think that we shall see miraculous progress in the short term. It would be better to make slow progress which can be sustained than miraculous progress which will go wrong again.

Mr. Archer

Has the Secretary of State now grasped the fact that the dialogue for which we had all hoped is being delayed to see whether his successor is wet, dry or damp? Much as we shall regret his passing, had it not better be soon?

Mr. Prior

I have no evidence to support that view.