HC Deb 11 July 1984 vol 63 cc1025-7
7. Mr. Amess

asked the Secretary of State for the Environment if he has yet reached a conclusion on whether he intends to take action with regard to section 142 of the Local Government Act 1972.

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Environment (Sir George Young)

My right hon. Friend has not yet reached a conclusion on this matter.

Mr. Amess

Is my hon. Friend aware that the continued misuse of section 142 of the Local Government Act is costing Basildon and GLC ratepayers thousands of pounds? Is he further aware that during the local district elections the Basildon district council launched a scurrilous propaganda campaign, which included a misquotation of the Minister for Housing and Construction and the misuse of a picture of Torvill and Dean? Is my hon. Friend aware that it is too expensive at the moment to pursue the matter through the courts?

Sir George Young

I hope that my hon. Friend's constituents will pursue with the district auditor, and through the courts, that instance, which he has drawn to the attention of the House in an early-day motion. Of course, ratepayers have every right to object to having to pay for propaganda with partisan distortions with which they profoundly disagree. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for the Environment has this matter under active review.

Mr. Tony Banks

Will the Secretary of State explain to those Conservative Members sitting behind him that nothing improper has been done by the GLC or metropolitan county councils over the use of section 142? The money has been spent legally. If the numbskulls behind the hon. Gentleman do not understand that, they should start reading the Act. Is the hon. Gentleman aware —I ask him this question just to try to save him and the Secretary of State from making more mistakes—that under section 142 the GLC and other local authorities spend money on advertisements for jobs and on public notices? If the hon. Gentleman makes any changes, those displays will fall foul of them.

Sir George Young

The Local Government Act 1972 was drafted at a time when councillors of all parties observed a general convention that ratepayers' money was not to be used for blatant party political propaganda. Because that convention has broken down the Government have had another look at section 142.

Mr. Conway

When my hon. Friend is examining section 142 and, I hope, section 137 of the Local Government Act, will he take time to examine the use of urban programme funds, which are also misused for party political propaganda, and ensure that money is not given to groups which have political objectives, at the expense of ratepayers and taxpayers?

Sir George Young

Ministers will, of course, look at any particular instances of abuse of the urban programme that my hon. Friend draws to their attention. His supplementary question raises the point that it is not just section 142 that is at the heart of local authority abuse —there is section 137 and other sections as well. That is why the Government are having a broad review on this subject.

Mr. Skinner

Is the Minister aware that the district auditor would have some difficulty in trying to sustain an argument made by ratepayers about excessive spending on advertisements and so on by local authorities when other public corporations have been doing exactly the same? For example, the National Coal Board has spent more than £2 million already. When it was asked whether that was excessive payment, it said—

Mr. Speaker

Order. It is such a pity. The Minister cannot answer for the National Coal Board.

Mr. Skinner

rose—

Mr. Speaker

Order. I called the hon. Gentleman to give him an opportunity to ask a question. He must not waste his chance.

Mr. Skinner

What I am trying to explain is that on this matter—[HON. MEMBERS: "Question."]

Mr. Speaker

Order. I am waiting for the question.

Mr. Skinner

I am asking the Minister to consider, when drawing a comparison between public bodies such as local authorities, to take into account the fact that another public corporation—the National Coal Board—has spent more than £2 million on putting out phoney propaganda—which will be paid for by the taxpayers—to try to defeat the strike. That matter must be taken into account.

Sir George Young

It is a pity that the hon. Gentleman could not see the picture of dismay on the faces of his hon. Friends behind him when he asked his question. Whatever section the NCB used, it was not section 142 of the Local Government Act. I note with interest that, despite the hon. Gentleman's eloquence, miners in Bolsover continue to work.

Mr. Meadowcroft

Is not the Minister's problem the fact that section 142 is permissive legislation? Is not the answer to the problem to support a freedom of information Bill which makes it obligatory to provide information, and which therefore has much less chance of being partisan?

Sir George Young

I am not sure that I follow the logic of the hon. Gentleman's intervention, but I can give him an assurance that we are scrutinising the legislation at the moment with a view to trying to bring to an end the abuse which I think the hon. Gentleman also condemns.

Mr. Peter Bruinvels

Does my hon. Friend agree that ratepayers are fed up with the gross abuse and party political propaganda displayed by Labour-controlled councils? Is he aware that in Leicester, for instance, up to £40,000 is being spent on a public relations exercise, at ratepayers' expense, to try to stop rate capping? Have we not had enough of this, and cannot we do something rapidly under section 142?

Sir George Young

My hon. Friend articulates a view that is held by many people. The problem is the mischief indulged in by an irresponsible minority, but I assure my hon. Friend that the particular abuses to which he referred are included in the review currently being undertaken within my Department.

Mr. Straw

As the Minister has a reputation as a liberal, will he resist the authoritarian wing of his party, which is so lacking in confidence in its own policies that it is seeking to crush the opposition and prevent the public from learning the truth about the Government's policies? Is it not time that the Government, instead of searching for the mote in the Labour party's eye, started to perceive the beam in their own eye? Is not the truth that the Government have outrageously abused the conventions relating to partisan political propaganda within the Ministry of Defence and the Prime Minister's press office, and that if section 142 applied to the Government every member of the Cabinet would by now have been surcharged and disqualified?

Sir George Young

Not so long ago the hon. Gentleman was a councillor in the London borough of Islington. If he was frank with himself, he would not tolerate for one moment the propaganda funded by that authority under these sections. Many other people on the Opposition Benches share that view.