HC Deb 15 February 1984 vol 54 cc256-7
10. Mr. Kirkwood

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland when he next plans to meet the chairman of the Forestry Commission.

Mr. John MacKay

My right hon. Friend meets the chairman of the Forestry Commission regularly, their most recent meeting being last Friday.

Mr. Kirkwood

When the Minister next meets the chairman of the Forestry Commission, will he put on the agenda the problem of the Government's refusal to release the purchase price figures for forestry estates in the forestry enterprises that belong to the Forestry Commission? Is the hon. Gentleman aware that, as a result of the great public concern that exists, some of us on the alliance Benches may have to take the information available to us from local forestry workers and place on early-day motions the purchase prices of those forests in -order to get round the problem? It is indefensible to keep such prices secret and it is not in the public interest.

Mr. MacKay

I have made it clear to the hon. Member that to disclose this information would amount to a breach of the normal confidentiality that is expected between purchaser and seller in land transactions. All sales of commission land and plantations have been made on the understanding that the details of the price paid by the purchaser would not be disclosed. There can be no question of going back on that. I assure the House, as I have done before, that the commission always sells at a price that reflects the value of the property to it for forestry purposes.

Sir Hector Monro

In view of various public statements, will my hon. Friend say how many jobs have been lost to forestry by sales to private individuals and how many have been lost through reorganisation within the Forestry Commission?

Mr. MacKay

Since 1 October 1981, the Forestry Commission estimates that some 916 jobs have been lost to the commission. Only about 20 of those jobs are linked to the sale of plantations. The rest of the job loss is associated with a combination of factors, including the loss of the market for timber, improvement in productivity, the use of contractors rather than direct labour in some areas and a continuing drive for efficiency.

Mr. Home Robertson

We know that the Government are hell-bent on throwing away public assets, including forestry, at any undisclosed cut price. Why do they refuse point blank even to include conditions in the sale agreements to get recognised public access to such lands? An example is a very popular forest walk in Pressmennan in east Lothian.

Mr. MacKay

We drew to the attention of the Forestry Commission guidelines to be borne in mind when it decided which plantations it would put up for sale. One thing we drew to its attention was public access. We expect the Forestry Commission to remember that, among other factors, when it considers which plantations it will sell. There is little or no evidence that new owners of forestry plantations, or, indeed, the large private sector which plants on its own account all over the country, deny access to the public.

Mr. Corrie

When he meets the commission, will my hon. Friend discuss with it whether acid rain is causing problems anywhere in Scotland, as it is in Europe? Will he also discuss the possibility of carrying out research to find out exactly what acid rain is and why it is causing such problems in Europe?

Mr. MacKay

The Forestry Commission, like other agencies, is concerned about the incidence of acid rain and its impact on timber-growing. I assure my hon. Friend that my right hon. Friend will draw these matters to the attention of the chairman of the Forestry Commission.

Mr. O'Neill

Is the Minister aware of the widespread anxiety and disgust at the clandestine handling of the sales of Forestry Commission lands? Is he also aware of the complete collapse of credibility and confidence in the Scottish Office as the lead Department in the disposal of the assets of Hamilton college of education? Will he take account—

Mr. Speaker

Order. I am not a Scot, but has this got anything to do with the Forestry Commission?

Mr. O'Neill

It is the lead Department which is selling off two sets of assets. If it can go so far wrong on one, as it has in regard to Hamilton college, it may get it even more wrong when it comes to the Forestry Commission, where we do not know the sums involved.

Mr. MacKay

It is a sad reflection on the Opposition spokesman on agriculture that he does not know a sitka spruce from Hamilton college of education. I have made my position on the sales perfectly clear. I should like to point out to the hon. Gentleman that, even after the sales programme as currently set down is completed, the Forestry Commission will remain a major force in the forestry industry.