Security (Hansard, 8 December 1983)

§ 3. Mr. Proctor
asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a statement on the security situation in Northern Ireland.

§ The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mr. James Prior)
Sadly I have to inform the House that since I last answered questions on 10 November, two members of the RUC, one UDR soldier and nine civilians have died in incidents arising from the security situation. The brutal murder of three of these civilians in the attack on Mountain Lodge Pentecostal hall on 20 November, about which I made a statement to the House the next day, and the cold-blooded murder of Mr. Edgar Graham, about which my hon. Friend the Minister of State made a statement yesterday, clearly demonstrate the barbarity of terrorism.
Despite the difficulties and dangers, members of the security forces have continued with their dedicated efforts to combat terrorist crime in all its forms. So far this year 580 people have been charged with terrorist-type offences, including 66 with murder and 59 with attempted murder, 204 weapons, over 34,000 rounds of ammunition and 3,762 lb of explosives have been recovered in the same period. The Government and the security forces will not be diverted from their tasks.

§ Mr. Proctor
Will my right hon. Friend accept that it is now his duty to remain in post to restore security in Northern Ireland, and by every word, act and deed convey to the terrorists the simple message that they will not win?

§ Mr. Prior
It is not often that I agree with my hon. Friend, but on this occasion I agree wholeheartedly with everything that he has said.

§ Rev. Martin Smyth
Does the Secretary of State accept that it is not a proper excuse for security 450 spokespersons to say that victims of terrorism did not ask for special protection, especially when they were aware of the dangers and when they tell us that the security authorities know best? Will he further accept that no responsible politician would ask for personal protection which could not be provided for his constituents?

§ Mr. Prior
Yes. I should like to make it plain that I realise the intensity of the hon. Gentleman's feelings, which I fully understand and share. It would be unreasonable if the decision whether protection was to be given was left to the individual, including the decision to ask for it. If the police think that there is that degree of risk, they should say that protection is to be given, and it should be given. I do not suggest that it was the responsibility of Mr. Edgar Graham to ask for protection.
I understand that inquiries were made through the offices of the hon. Gentleman following the expression of his view that there was a threat to Mr. Graham. I am sorry to take a little time in dealing with this supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Graham was seen and advised about the additional protection which he could take himself and which could be offered to him. He was not considered to be at greater risk than many others and there was no intelligence to suggest that he was a specific target. The RUC's problem is that it receives information from the public about specific threats and targets each day. It then has to form a judgment on how much protection it is able to give. It is not possible to protect everyone in these circumstances. I wish to remove any idea that it was up to Mr. Graham to ask for protection. It certainly was not.

§ Mr. Peter Robinson
In the light of the terrorist statistics which the Secretary of State has outlined, will he state which of the following propositions he believes to be the more unreasonable: that Northern Ireland Members should request meetings with the Chief Constable of Northern Ireland about incidents in their constituencies, or that the Chief Constable should refuse all such meetings?

§ Mr. Prior
The Chief Constable is responsible for security and I wish to make it plain that he must make his own decisions. He is responsible to the Police Authority. I believe that Northern Ireland is extremely fortunate in having a man of the integrity of the present Chief Constable. He is faced with extremely difficult problems. I understand the hon. Gentleman's point about the Chief Constable's relationship with Members of Parliament. There is a problem there, but, in the specific and special circumstances of Northern Ireland, it must be for the Chief Constable to decide whom he sees and whom he does not. I have offered a meeting with the political leaders at which both the Chief Constable and the GOC would be present. I shall ascertain whether there are other ways of making a meeting possible.

§ Mr. Merlyn Rees
May I return to the question of the tragic death of Mr. Edgar Graham yesterday? Does the right hon. Gentleman recall the allegation that Mr. Graham made in the Assembly recently, which was that so-called Loyalist paramilitaries and Republican paramilitaries were collaborating to kill Ulster politicians, who have a much more difficult job than any of us in this place? Is there any evidence that the allegation made by Mr. Graham of collaboration between killers, who have more in common with one another than they do with anyone else, was true?

§ Mr. Prior
There is no specific evidence, although there is a good deal of anecdotal evidence to that effect. I join the right hon. Gentleman in saying that those who take the responsibility of democratic government in Northern Ireland have an extraordinarily difficult job to undertake. I should like to thank them for the part that they play.

§ Mr. Latham
Is my right hon. Friend aware that, with the unending abominations and atrocities that come from the troubled Province of Northern Ireland, there is great support for him in all corners of the House as he undertakes his duties, and that many hon. Members are prepared to ensure that whatever resources are necessary are provided to help him to restore law and order in the Province?

§ Mr. Prior
I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I asked both the GOC and the Chief Constable whether they required additional resources and they told me that they did not. If at any time they come to me—I have seen the Chief Constable three times in the past 24 hours—and ask for additional resources, I know that the Government will be prepared to grant them. We need to have the best security forces that we can possibly provide and the wholehearted co-operation of all people in Northern Ireland, in the same way as I believe that I have the wholehearted co-operation of everyone in the House in doing what I can.

Several Hon. Members
rose——

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. There are later questions on security.