HC Deb 15 March 1982 vol 20 cc11-2
11. Mr. Wigley

asked the Secretary of State for Wales what is the total payment expected to be made during 1981–82 by the Severn-Trent water authority and the North-West water authority, respectively, to the Welsh water authority in relation to the water they abstract from Wales.

Mr. Wyn Roberts

In 1981–82, sums of £1, 340, 000 and £323, 700 were payable respectively by the Severn-Trent water authority and the North-West water authority in respect of bulk supplies of water from Wales. A further £203, 000 and £2, 301, 300 were payable respectively by those authorities in respect of bulk supplies from the English parts of the WWA's area.

Mr. Wigley

Does the Under-Secretary accept that those are wholly derisory payments for the water taken from Wales and amount to only about 1 per cent. of the WWA's turnover? Does he accept that a payment of, say, 25p per 1, 000 gallons would give Wales an income of £40 million, which would be enough to bring down the water rates in Wales by between 20 and 40 per cent? What is the latest position on the proposal for increased payments, put to the Welsh Office by the WWA in October?

Mr. Roberts

I do not regard those millions of pounds as derisory and I am sure that the WWA does not. There is a dispute between the Welsh authority and the Severn-Trent and North-West authorities. We were notified of that in September last year and as it was the first reference to my right hon. Friends under the legislation we were naturally anxious to agree the correct procedure for dealing with it. A memorandum of principles and procedure was sent to the water authorities concerned on 16 February and the Welsh authority was asked to submit its representations by 16 March. We have not received those representations, but we are still hopeful that the decision will be made in May.

Mr. Stokes

Is my hon. Friend aware that my constituents in Halesowen and Stourbridge are customers of the Severn-Trent water authority and that I receive many complaints about its high charges? Will he therefore please ensure that no representations from the hon. Member for Caernarvon (Mr. Wigley) have any effect in increasing those charges?

Mr. Roberts

All such factors will have to be taken into account by my right hon. Friend. It is as well to point out that, on the basis of combined average domestic bills for the coming year, Wales is about third in the league table of water authority charges in England and Wales.

Mr. Alec Jones

Does not the Minister realise that the transfer of water from one water authority to another on a no-profit, no-loss basis can be justified only so long as there is no wide disparity between the charges levied by those water authorities? If the Labour Government's Water Charges Equalisation Act 1977 was defective, which I dispute, why did not the Government either improve or modify the Act rather than abandon it and thereby cost the Welsh water authority at least £3 million a year?

Mr. Roberts

The right hon. Gentleman must really get this matter into perspective. The amount obtained by the water authority from equalisation was a decreasing amount. The effect of the Act was eccentric. It drove an increasing number, 42 per cent. in all, away from the median of charges. I know of no other system that does not have this kind of perverse effect.

Mr. Wigley

On a point of Order, Mr. Speaker. In view of the unsatisfactory nature of that reply, I shall continue to seek to raise this matter on the Adjournment.