§ 19. Mr. Greenwayasked the hon. Member for Wokingham, as representing the Church Commissioners, what guidance is given to incumbents as to the desirability of opening their churches.
§ Sir William van Straubenzee (The Second Church Estates Commissioner, Representing Church Commissioners)None, Sir, because this does not fall within the responsibility of the Church Commissioners. It is for the incumbent and parochial church council to take a decision as to whether and for how long its church should be open to the public.
§ Mr. GreenwayI recognise that the Church Commissioners have no responsibility in this area. Does my hon. Friend share my deep concern that most churches are permanently locked against the vandal and the thief, thus depriving ordinary people of entrance to them? Does he not consider that it would be a good idea if suitable people offered their services to vicars and incumbents as church watchers, who would guard churches for certain periods during the day? This would enable churches to be open and so permit all citizens to use them for the purposes of the soul.
§ Sir William van StraubenzeeI am grateful to my hon. Friend for his understanding of the limitations of the responsibilities of the Church Commissioners. As an individual, I share his anxiety. This, alas, is a factor of our present life that extends far beyond churches. But churches are a good example of the problem of leaving premises unattended.
§ Mr. Robert AtkinsI wish to support my hon. Friend the Member for Ealing, North (Mr. Greenway) in his request for keeping open churches. I spend what little spare time is available to me visiting churches. Is my hon. Friend aware to what extent vandalism and hooliganism within churches is increasing or decreasing?
§ Sir William van StraubenzeeI am afraid that I have no statistics that I can give my hon. Friend. I thought the original suggestion of voluntary wardens was helpful. I hope that it will attract publicity. I share the anxiety expressed by hon. Friend the Member for Preston, North (Mr. Atkins). I think he will find that a note will be found in most well-run churches explaining where the key can be obtained on application.
Mr. J. Enoch PowellDoes the hon. Gentleman agree that this problem is by no means new, as the number of watching chambers dating from the Middle Ages bears witness? Is he aware that the solution suggested by the hon. Member for Ealing, North (Mr. Greenway) deserves wide adoption? Does he agree that when it is not possible to have a roster for watching, a roster for ensuring that a means of opening churches is available would be second best?
§ Sir William van StraubenzeeThe right hon. Gentleman makes an extremely helpful comment. It is a fact, I suggest, that in former years we were somewhat more robust in dealing with those who were discovered doing these things. We shall, perhaps, have to reconsider this aspect of the matter.