Assembly (Sinn Fein Members) (Hansard, 23 December 1982)

§ 12. Mr. Dubs
asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland on how many occasions (a) Ministers in his Department and (b) civil servants have had meetings with elected Sinn Fein Members of the Northern Ireland Assembly; and what issues were discussed.

§ Mr. Prior
Since the recent Assembly elections there has been one meeting between an Under-Secretary of State and a delegation of elected representatives which included, among others, a Sinn Fein Assembly Member. The meeting was arranged to discuss housing matters in an area of Belfast. All the elected Sinn Fein representatives have had contact with Government officials at a local level on a range of constituency matters. I have made it clear that I am not prepared to talk to Sinn Fein Assembly Members about general issues until that party unequivocally repudiates violence.

§ Mr. Dubs
Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that his answer puts into a different context some of the arguments that took place about the proposed visit of Sinn Fein members to London a couple of weeks ago and that it is preferable to involve those people in political discussions, because that is the best way of persuading them that democratic political processes are preferable to violence?

§ Mr. Prior
The great mistake made by Mr. Livingstone two weeks ago was to invite Sinn Fein representatives for general discussions. If he had said "If you want to come, repudiate violence before you come", that would have been a very great step forward. The Sinn Fein Members of the Assembly were elected and there are constituency matters in which they are involved. We are following the long-established pattern that on constituency matters we allow the local elected people to have access to Ministers and officials. But that does not alter one iota the view that we all hold that we must repudiate violence of every sort from wherever it comes.

§ Mr. McCusker
Does not the Secretary of State's reply throw into sharp relief the hypocrisy that was displayed two weeks ago? Can the right hon. Gentleman tell us what it feels like, and what his Ministers and civil servants feel like, to have discussions with men who are described as terrorists and as having been involved in the planning and implementation of terrorist offences? Does not the right hon. Gentleman realise that it is offensive to the people of Northern Ireland to have their whole country turned into an interment camp to save the rest of the United Kingdom? The Secretary of State cannot hide behind the legislation. If people are considered terrorists and a danger in London, they should be regarded as terrorists and a danger in Belfast, and the Government should act accordingly.

§ Mr. Prior
The hon. Gentleman does not do his case any good and does not help to create peace in Northern Ireland by seeking to stir it up in that manner. However, of course I sympathise with, and understand, the point that the hon. Gentleman makes. The difficulty is that the people of whom we are speaking are resident in Northern Ireland and there is no way in which one can ban them from their own country.

§ Rev. Ian Paisley
Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that at a convention in Dublin a few days after the Assembly elections the elected representatives of Sinn Fein pledged themselves unequivocally to back the armed struggle and the campaign of murder in Northern Ireland? Does he not feel that the people of Northern Ireland are justifiably stirred up by the two attitudes that are adopted—one in London and another in Northern Ireland?

§ Mr. Prior
I understand the views of the people of Northern Ireland. I have had them expressed to me in no uncertain terms. The point is that evidence used by the Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis to advise the Home Secretary not to admit people to Britain may not be sufficient to bring about a conviction in a court in Northern Ireland. If we can get the necessary evidence against these people, charges will be brought.