§ 1. Mr. Biggs-Davisonasked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland whether he will make a statement on the state of law and order in the Province.
§ 4. Mr. Farrasked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a statement on the current security situation.
§ 5. Mr. Trippierasked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a statement on the security situation in Northern Ireland.
§ 7. Mr. Molyneauxasked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a statement on the security situation.
§ 9. Rev. Ian Paisleyasked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland if he will make a statement on the security situation in Northern Ireland.
§ The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mr. Humphrey Atkins)The police, supported by the Army, remain steadfast in their efforts to put an end to terrorist attacks and in their pursuit of those who have committed them. In recent days they have also had to face the challenge of maintaining public order on the streets. Recent demonstrations and disorder have tested their capacity but they have proved well equal to keeping the situation under control. The methods employed by the security forces are essentially for the judgment of their own commanders. But I am in very regular contact with the Chief Constable and the GOC and both have assured me that they have all the resources they need for the job.
Recent events have shown the people of Northern Ireland yet again that the terrorists have nothing whatever to offer them. By and large, the community has responded well to appeals from many people in the Province to 868 remain calm and to leave the maintenance of law and order to the security forces. I appeal particularly to parents not to allow their children to participate in rioting or other unlawful activities.
§ Mr. Biggs-DavisonApart from the support given by such as Mr. Ken Livingstone and the naive notions of the right hon. Member for Bristol, South-East (Mr. Benn), has not disorder been encouraged by some media men, mostly foreign, and has anyone been arrested for renting a mob to attack the security forces, to whom my right hon. Friend has justly paid tribute?
§ Mr. AtkinsI, too, have heard reports of the activities of some people connected with the media—mostly foreigners. I think that the whole House would deplore the activities of anyone who encouraged or engendered trouble simply for the purpose of getting pictures for his television programme. I hope that that has not happened, but I am told that it has. I hope that it will not happen any more. The Chief Constable, with my full backing, is absolutely determined that if he finds anyone engaging in such activity that person will be arrested.
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. I intend to call first those hon. Members whose questions are being answered together.
§ Mr. FarrWas my right hon. Friend consulted by the Football Association before it took the deplorable decision to cancel the England v. Northern Ireland football match, for which 40,000 tickets or more had already been sold? If my right hon. Friend was consulted, what sort of advice did he give?
§ Mr. AtkinsI spoke to the secretary of the FA on the morning before it made its announcement. I was able to assure him, from a conversation which I had had with the Chief Constable only 10 minutes beforehand, that the Chief Constable saw no risk to players or spectators if the match were to take place, and also saw no difficulty in providing the necessary police presence at the match, since that would in no way overstretch his forces. I told this to the secretary of the FA, and I am very sorry, as indeed is everyone in Northern Ireland, that the match is not to take place.
§ Mr. TrippierIs it not true to say that the main aim of the terrorists and those fomenting unrest in the Province is to frustrate the normal political process? Do the Government remain committed to giving the people of Northern Ireland more control over their own affairs?
§ Mr. AtkinsI agree with my hon. Friend that this is undoubtedly one of the terrorists' main aims—indeed, one of their stated aims. They aim to destroy the Government of the North and following that the Government of the Republic, and to bring to an end the democratic regime under which we all live. It remains the Government's determination that that aim will be frustrated. There is a better way of working out our future than by killing other people or ourselves and that is the democratic process, which must continue. That is going on next week in the local elections that will take place in Northern Ireland. It remains Her Majesty's Government's view that that is the way forward. We shall be pursuing it as energetically as we can.
§ Mr. MolyneauxWill the Secretary of State undertake to introduce help measures and suitable equipment to 869 prevent Christian savages from burning to death members of the security forces who are engaged in the protection of life and property?
§ Mr. AtkinsThe Chief Constable and the GOC are content with the size and equipment of the forces which they are using to maintain law and order. I know that the entire House would like to pay tribute to the security forces. These young men, on our behalf, contain disorder in the streets of Belfast, have stones and petrol bombs thrown at them and use the minimum of force to keep order. They have the equipment and strength that they require. I am in close touch with both security commanders, and, so far as I am concerned, whatever they want they can have.
§ Mr. ConcannonOur thanks must go out to the security forces for the way in which they are handling a dreadful situation. Does the right hon. Gentleman accept that he should not be deflected from working towards a lasting solution to the Ireland problem, a political solution that takes account of all sections of opinion within the community?
§ Mr. AtkinsYes. I thank the right hon. Gentleman for his reference to the security forces. I agree with him. I was told the moment that I assumed this office about two years ago that a military solution could never be found to the problem. We want a political advance. That is what the Government have been seeking. Unfortunately the Provisionals and others have abandoned any idea of political solutions and they are seeking to impose their will by force—force against the community and, occasionally, force against their own members. They will not succeed.
§ Mr. KilfedderAs violence is the enemy of democracy, does the Secretary of State appreciate that the best news recently heard by the law-abiding Ulster majority was the statement that the evil bunch of murderers and thugs belonging to the Provisional IRA in the H block had decided on a hunger strike to death when presumably in the after-life they will experience the hell that they have created for so many innocent people in Northern Ireland?
§ Mr. AtkinsI shall not take up the hon. Gentleman's theological references. We deplore any death, whether it is inflicted by a terrorist on innocent people or inflicted on himself. I hope very much that those who are on hunger strike or who are contemplating going on it will realise that the exercise is totally fruitless. They will achieve nothing save their own destruction.
§ Mr. FittI revert to the supplementary question asked by the hon. Member for Epping Forest (Mr. Biggs-Davison). Will the Secretary of State carry out the most thorough investigations into a tragic incident that took place a few hours after the death of Mr. Sands at the top of the New Lodge Road in the Antrim Road not very far from my home, in which an innocent milk delivery man and his young son were brutally and savagely attacked, which subsequently led to the death of both the young boy and his father, the latter having died yesterday afternoon? Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that within seconds of those stones being thrown a television camera crew was on the scene? There are many who are of the belief that that crowd was agitated into throwing stones for the benefit of foreign television cameras. The end result was that two innocent people lost their lives. Will he give an 870 undertaking that the Chief Constable of Northern Ireland will carry out the most far-reaching inquiry into that occurrence to ascertain the identity of the camera crew?
§ Mr. AtkinsYes, Sir, I readily give that undertaking. Nobody is keener to do what the hon. Gentleman suggests than the Chief Constable and myself. In fact, it is being done. That occurrence and others have been reported to us where it is thought that despicable activity of the sort to which the hon. Gentleman has referred has taken place. In default of evidence there cannot be prosecution. Let us see how the Chief Constable gets on. Mr. Guiney and his young son were delivering milk to the people of West Belfast and tragically both are now dead. They were attacked by a gang of rioters with stones and their milk lorry crashed. That event killed them both. Many hon. Members may have seen pictures of the funeral of the young Guiney two days ago. They will have seen the distress, unhappiness and misery that has been caused to him, his family and his friends.
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. This matter arises again later.