HC Deb 13 May 1981 vol 4 cc764-5
30. Mr. Canavan

asked the Solicitor-General for Scotland whether he will meet the Scottish Law Commission to discuss its recent report on warrant sales.

The Solicitor-General for Scotland

I have no plans at present to meet the Scottish Law Commission to discuss its second memorandum on diligence, poindings and warrant sales.

Mr. Canavan

Will the Solicitor-General for Scotland tell the Scottish Law Commission that there is bitter disappointment that, after a decade of deliberation, all it has managed to achieve are a few pussy-footed proposals? Will he compliment the print union SOGAT on taking direct trade union action to stop the shameful practice of advertising warrant sales? Will he consider adding his name to the list of sponsors of the Private Member's Bill which I hope to reintroduce on 3 June, which will stop that barbaric, medieval practice once and for all?

The Solicitor-General for Scotland

I note that the hon. Member used the words "barbaric and medieval practice". It amazes me that someone of his fluency cannot think up two alternative adjectives. He used those words on 20 February—

Mr. Canavan

That shows that I am consistent.

The Solicitor-General for Scotland

It shows that the hon. Member is consistent, but it also shows that he is boring. The hon. Member has introduced a Bill to control the employment of sheriff officers, presumably meaning that they should be unemployed. That seems contrary to his concept of the matter. I know that the hon. Member wishes to have a debt arbitration service, which would increase the burden of the State on those who pay. He favours a situation in which no one owns anything. Therefore, there would be no question of warrant sales. Nevertheless, all civilised systems have them, regretfully. There are only 300 in Scotland. It is a system on which the Law Commission has reported and which will be reviewed.

Mr. McQuarrie

I accept my hon. and learned Friend's reply to this question. Would not he further consider the situation in view of the degrading circumstances which people suffer? Is he aware that when sheriff officers arrive at many of the homes early in the morning the children are put in fear of their lives when the officers knock down the doors to take out the goods?

The Solicitor-General for Scotland

If my hon. Friend has any evidence of such conduct, he should report it. That action is a last resort. There is no evidence that it is taken in circumstances which are wrong or unfortunate. I would have thought that my hon. Friend would remember that in those circumstances there are creditors as well as debtors to be considered.

Mr. Dempsey

If the Solicitor-General is unwilling to meet the Law Commission, will he at least draw its attention to the disgraceful practice by the sheriff officers in selling household effects at bargain basement prices, as if the debtors did not suffer enough? Will he insist that the Law Commission ensures that such goods are sold at market prices in future?

The Solicitor-General for Scotland

I always understood that the bargain price and the market price were the same. Let us be clear about the matter. The Scottish Law Commission has reported responsibly. The law of diligence and the law of warrant sales are bound up together. It is not a question of taking advantage of people. The circumstances of each of the 300 cases are available for any hon. Member to discover. If the hon. Member can demonstrate anything which is wrong about any case, he should bring it to my attention.

Mr. John MacKay

Does my hon. and learned Friend realise that, while some of us accept that creditors have rights in such matters, some of us feel that warrant sales are a problem and that we should consider a more humane way Of dealing with that difficult social problem?

The Solicitor-General for Scotland

This is a matter of last resort. All that is possible is done to prevent any inhumane action being taken. If any hon. Members can bring to my attention a particular case in which they think injustice has been done, they should do so.

Mr. Millan

Is the Solicitor-General aware that there are umpteen cases of injustice being done? This is a degrading system. Even the Law Commission, which wished to retain the system as a last resort, said that it was urgently in need of substantial reform. Is the Solicitor-General saying that the Government will do nothing about the Law Commission report, which was the product of 10 years' study? The system must be reformed. That view is held 100 per cent. by people in Scotland. Something must be done.

The Solicitor-General for Scotland

I assure the right hon. Gentleman that we have carefully read the vast report on the law of diligence which the Law Commission produced. It produced that report with great diligence, in another sense. Its comments on the law of warrant sales are being taken into consideration, but it would not be appropriate, as I am sure the right hon. Gentleman will agree, to deal with that matter separately from the law of diligence.

Mr. Dempsey

In view of the unsatisfactory nature of that reply, I beg to give notice that I shall seek to raise this matter on the Adjournment at the earliest opportunity.