HC Deb 23 March 1981 vol 1 cc627-8
34. Mr. Dormand

asked the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster what reciprocal arrangements exist for access to Galleries of this House by Peers and to those of another place by hon. Members.

Mr. Pym

The Peers' Gallery in the House of Commons is reserved for actual Members of the other place.

I understand from the authorities of that House that Members of the House of Commons are permitted to stand behind the Bar in their Chamber, provided there is room. Seats are also available for Members and their guests in a Gallery there.

Mr. Dormand

Is the Minister aware of the difficulty caused when hon. Members of this House cannot stay with their friends and constituents in the Public Gallery in another place? As this happens so infrequently, surely no problems are caused, especially as most hon. Members stay there for only a very short time. Will he seek to have the practice changed?

Mr. Pym

That is something that could be raised by the House with another place, but I understand that 24 seats are available for hon. Members and their guests. The hon. Member shakes his head, but that is what I have been advised. I take note of what he says and will see whether any alteration can be made. I think that the geography and the space available would limit the scope for any considerable enlargement, but I shall take the matter further.

Mr. Dickens

Will my right hon. Friend please explain to the House why, on innumerable occasions, we see empty seats in the Galleries of this and the other place, and yet members of the public are consistently shut out on occasions, such as at Question Time? Has my right hon. Friend any plan to review the whole question of seats in the Gallery in order to give the public more opportunity to listen to our debates?

Mr. Pym

On the whole, the Gallery is usually full at Question Time and at the beginning of debates. I have little doubt that the reason why later on in the afternoon and in the evening the number of visitors thins out is that quite often debates here can be reasonably boring. When we have really interesting debates, which are keenly attended by hon. Members, the Galleries tend to be full.

The House has from time to time reviewed the arrangements for tickets and the issuing of tickets, and I am not aware of any general desire in the House to alter our present practice.

Mr. George Cunningham

Is the Leader of the House aware that sometimes guests of hon. Members of this House are not able to see the proceedings because Members of the other House bundle in and stand in the corner of the Gallery, thus getting in the way of guests of this House? Will he take steps to prevent that?

Mr. Pym

That is a matter that I can raise with the Serjeant at Arms. It would be the appropriate quarter. I shall take it up.

Mr. Dykes

Is any progress being made on giving access to Members of the European Parliament, under controlled conditions?

Mr. Pym

Not at the moment.