HC Deb 30 July 1981 vol 9 cc1284-8

The bodies to be notified of the making and confirmation of public paths orders and of orders made under this Part shall include—

  1. (i) in relation to the whole of England and Wales, the British Horse Society, the Byways and Bridleways Trust, the Commons, Open Spaces and Footpaths Preservation Society, the Ramblers' Association and the Trail Riders Fellowship;
  2. (ii) in relation to the districts of Aylesbury Vale, Chiltern, South Buckinghamshire and Wycombe in the county of Buckinghamshire, the districts of Dacorum and Three Rivers in the county of Hertfordshire and the district of South Oxfordshire in the county of Oxfordshire, the Chiltern Society;
  3. (iii) in relation to the county of Derbyshire, the Derbyshire Footpath Preservation Society;
  4. (iv) in relation to the districts of High Peak, North East Derbyshire and West Derbyshire in the county of Derbyshire, the districts of Macclesfield and Vale Royal in the county of Cheshire and the county of Greater Manchester, the Peak and Northern Footpaths Society;
  5. (v) in relation to the districts of Chester, Crewe and Nantwich and Vale Royal in the county of Cheshire, the Mid-Cheshire Footpath Society;
  6. (vi) in relation to the county of Oxfordshire, the Oxford Fieldpaths Society;
  7. (vii) in relation to the counties of East Sussex and West Sussex, the Sussex Rights of Way Group;
  8. (viii) in relation to the county of Kent, the Kent Rights of Way Council;
    9. 1285
  9. (ix) in relation to the county of Nottinghamshire, the Nottinghamshire Footpath Preservation Society;
  10. (x) in relation to the district of Malvern Hills in the county of Hereford and Worcester, the Malvern Hills District Footpath Society;
  11. (xi) in relation to the county of Leicestershire, the Leicestershire Footpath Association;
  12. (xii) in relation to the district of New Forest in the county of Hampshire, the Ringwood and Fordingbridge Footpath Society;
  13. (xiii) in relation to the district of Wigan in the county of Grater Manchester, the Wigan Footpath Society.—[Mr. Andrew F. Bennett.]

Brought up, and read the First time.

Mr. Andrew F. Bennett

I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.

Mr. Deputy Speaker

With this we shall take the following:

Amendment No. 246, in schedule 14, page 98, line 40, leave out from 'serving' to 'and' in line 2 on page 99 and insert 'on—

  1. (i) every owner and occupier of any of that land, a like notice together with a copy of so much of the order as relates to the land owned or occupied, as the case may be;
  2. (ii) every local authority whose area includes any of that land, a like notice together with a copy of so much of the order as relates to the land in the area of the authority;
  3. (iii) such other bodies as may be prescribed or as the authority may consider appropriate, a like notice together with a copy of the order;'.

Government amendments Nos. 298 and 299.

Amendment No. 247, in page 99, line 2, leave out 'and' and insert— '(iv) any person who has signified by prepayment to the authority of such reasonable charge as the authority may determine that he wishes to receive a copy of any such notice, or, where the authority is a county council, such notices as relate to a particular district within the area of the authority, a like notice; and'.

Government amendments Nos. 300 to 302.

Amendment No. 248, in page 102, line 32, at end insert— '(2A) If the order has been modified by the Secretary of State the notice required to be served by sub-paragraph (2)(b) of this paragraph shall be accompanied—

  1. (i) in the case of every owner and occupier of any land to which the modification relates, by a copy of so much of the order as confirmed as relates to the land owned or occupied, as the case may be;
  2. (ii) in the case of every local authority whose area includes any of the land to which the modification relates, by a copy of so much of the order as confirmed as relates to land in the area of the authority;
  3. (iii) in the case of such bodies as may be prescribed or as the authority may consider appropriate, by a copy of the order as confirmed.'.

Government amendment No. 303.

Amendment No. 249, in schedule 15, page 103, line 41, leave out first 'and' and insert— '(v) any person who has signified by prepayment to the authority of such reasonable charge as the authority may determine that he wishes to receive a copy of the notice, or, where the authority is a county council, such notices as relate to a particular district within the area of the authority; and '.

Government amendments Nos. 304 and 305.

Amendment No. 250, in page 104, line 24 at end insert— '(7) A notice required to be served under sub-paragraph 1(2)(b) above, other than a notice required to be served by sub-paragraph 1(2)(b)(v), shall be accompanied by a copy of the order.'.

Government amendment No. 306.

Amendment No. 251, in page 105, line 29, leave out '(iv)' and insert '(v)'.

Amendment No. 252, in page 105, line 29 after 'shall', insert 'if the order has been modified'.

Government amendment No. 307.

Amendment No. 253, in page 106, line 31, leave out 'and' and insert— '(vi) any person who has signified by prepayment to the authority of such reasonable charge as the authority may determine that he wishes to receive a copy of the notice, or, where the authority is a county council, such notices as relate to a particular district within the area of the authority; and'.

Government amendments Nos. 308 to 312.

Amendment No. 254, in page 107, line 9, at end insert— '(3E) A notice required to be served under sub-paragraph 1(3)(b) above, other than one required to be served by sub-paragraph 1(3)(b)(iv), shall be accompanied by a copy of the order.'.

Government amendment No. 314.

Amendment No. 255, in page 108, line 9, leave out '(iii)' and insert '(iv)'.

Amendment No. 256, in page 108, line 10, after 'shall', insert 'if the order has been modified'

Mr. Bennett

New clause 28 is a paving clause for a whole series of amendments, including Government amendments, many of which we very much welcome.

Many people have paid tribute to the work of the Spicer committee and the hon. Member who chaired it. Most of the amendments in this group come from the work of the committee, which put forward agreed procedures. In one or two places the Government have now used their own drafting.

The point of tabling new clause 28 was not to get all the bodies listed in it on to the face of the Bill, because although they are all excellent they vary from time to time. I seek an undertaking from the Minister that all the bodies will be entitled to receive the standing orders that are drawn up—to ensure that everyone who is concerned about footpath proposals can get the relevant information.

I do not want to press new clause 28, therefore, but I press the Minister firmly to give an undertaking that all the organisations that I have mentioned, and any others that may have been missed out, will get all the necessary information. I welcome the agreed amendments and express the hope that in practice they will work satisfactorily.

11.30 pm
Mr. Michael Spicer (Worcestershire, South)

I warmly welcome the Government amendments. It clearly was right that the so-called Spicer committee's recommendations formed a package which should have been implemented. The original suggestion was that the taxpayer should be saved up to £500,000 by the abolition of the need to notify in the London Gazette, and the quid pro quo was always that individuals should receive, on a prepayment, standing order basis, notices of the order changes, and that certain prescribed bodies should receive the orders.

The hon. Member for Stockport, North (Mr. Bennett) has a point in new clause 28 in seeking some indication which those prescribed bodies are. There is no question in my mind but that it is right that the Government should have made such a move. I do not want to get into a quarrel with the hon. Member, but the Government's action slightly belies something he said about an hour ago—that there has been no compromise by the Government towards the interests in which he is particularly interested, in this case the walkers. That is an example where there has been a compromise.

My only minor grumble concerns a point that I raised on Second Reading on 27 April. I do not go so far as one of my hon. Friends who said that the taxpayer could have been saved £20, which is the return fare from Evesham to Paddington, if the Government had let us know in advance that they were to move these amendments. I do not press that point because I feel strongly about other later amendments, and I do not want to upset the Government. I certainly will not wish to move amendments Nos. 246 and 248 which stand in my name and the names of other hon. Members.

Mr. Monro

I think that the hon. Member for Stockport, North (Mr. Bennett) will realise that the large number of Government amendments which I shall move formally at the appropriate moment cover the issues we discussed in Committee about giving adequate publicity. The amendments we have tabled overtake the hon. Gentleman's new clause 28 in that all the organisations mentioned will, under the procedure in the Government amendments, have ample opportunity to receive the information.

The Government amendments implement the recommendations of the Spicer committee, and even in the presence of my hon. Friend the Member for Worcestershire, South (Mr. Spicer) I commend the great work that the committee has done. The copies of the orders as may be confirmed will be sent to landowners, other local authorities, national path users' organisations prescribed by the Secretary of State, and such local organisations representing path users as seem appropriate to local authorities.

In addition, it should be possible for individual members of the public, on payment of a reasonable charge, to arrange with order-making authorities to receive personal notification of the orders as they are made. I shall be astonished if anyone interested in this issue is not able to receive all the information that he requires. I believe that this long series of amendments covers all the issues.

Mr. Andrew F. Bennett

The Minister has agreed that he will prescribe these national organisations. Is it his intention to prescribe any local ones in the regulations?

Mr. Monro

I should like to be certain before I give the hon. Member a reply to that point. Obviously the national organisations would get the information, and I would be surprised if the local organisations representing the path users and so on could not come to an arrangement with the local authority to receive the same information. I shall consult and take steps to ensure that there is the maximum possible publicity on this issue. I am sure that the hon. Gentleman will not be disappointed with the steps that we take.

Mr. Bennett

I thank the Minister for the undertakings that he has given. I welcome the fact that he has given a clear indication that all the bodies we have listed in new clause 28 will be able to benefit from the procedures.Everyone will welcome the new procedures, and, although this is a fairly limited area, I hope that it will work well.

I therefore beg to ask leave to withdraw the clause and hope that in due course we can vote on to the face of the Bill the amendments tabled by the Government.

Motion and clause, by leave, withdrawn.

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