HC Deb 24 February 1981 vol 999 cc733-4
7. Mr. Ron Brown

asked the Secretary of State for Employment, further to his reply to the hon. Member for Chippenham (Mr. Needham), Official Report, 27 January, c. 371, if he will make a statement on the further action being considered by the Government and the Manpower Services Commission to encourage industry to improve its skill training.

Mr. Peter Morrison

We hope to publish shortly a discussion paper on training for the 1980s, which is intended to lead to a joint programme of action by Government, industry and the education and training services to improve the effectiveness of our national training arrangements. Unless radical change is achieved, the prospects of economic revival, living standards and employment will all be the poorer.

Mr. Brown

Is the Minister really satisfied that the Government are doing enough to create real jobs? Is he aware, for example, that the CBI has complained of a shortage of skilled labour in this country? I can give the Minister all the details if he wishes, but I am sure that he knows them. Is he aware that many skinflint employers are using youngsters as cheap labour? Is he aware that for many of those employers this is an alternative means of running their companies to produce more and more profit? Is he aware that something must be done about this— [HON. MEMBERS: "TOO long."] Would it not be better for the Government to agree to do something to make apprenticeships compulsory—

Mr. Speaker

Order. The hon. Member must realise that he must sit down when I stand up. I call the Minister to reply.

Mr. Morrison

I am somewhat amazed by the hon. Member and indeed by all Opposition Members when they complain bitterly that we are spending a lot of money on something such as the youth opportunities programme. Certainly, that is the inference that I draw. With regard to skill shortages, I should have thought that the fact that we are looking again at training and that the Government are to produce another paper on the matter would demonstrate that we are concerned about this.

Mr. Peter Lloyd

Does my hon. Friend accept that there is very considerable concern in industry and in the training boards themselves that the future of training boards is being considered and the evidence concerning them filtered entirely through the MSC? Can he assure the House that he and his right hon. Friend will acquaint themselves fully and at first hand with the opinions of the training boards and of the firms in industry about the future of training boards before reaching their final decisions?

Mr. Morrison

Yes, Sir.

Mr. Barry Jones

What urgent action will the Minister take to reduce the sacking of young trainee craftsmen and technicians? Does he realise that this year apprenticeship training has declined by 10 per cent.? Is he aware, for example, that the number of Government-supported apprenticeships in the chemical industry has plummeted from 523 in 1979 to 124 today? Will the Minister protect our industrial seed corn?

Mr. Morrison

As I have already said, we are spending £46 million this year to help apprentices. That accounts for help to 25,000 apprentices. To my way of thinking, that is the right way of looking at it.