HC Deb 23 February 1981 vol 999 cc643-4
10. Mr Adley

asked the Secretary of State for Energy if he is satisfied that his policies in relation to energy conservation are fully understood by the general public.

Mr. John Moore

Expenditure on information and advice provided by my Department has been increased by 30 per cent. in real terms in 1980–81 as part or our efforts to help the public understand the reality of energy price changes at a time when world energy prices are increasing rapidly. Since the beginning of 1979, world dollar oil prices have risen by 175 per cent. or more than doubled, excluding general inflation. We believe that the message is getting through.

Mr. Adley

Does my hon. Friend agree that the presentation of the Government's energy policy illustrates the dilemma of having a good policy not very well explained, which is not unknown to Conservative Governments? Where conservation is a major factor in energy pricing, will he and his colleagues do their best to do a little better than they have done to explain the policies, which I am sure are adequate, in language that people can understand?

Mr. Moore

I shall always listen to my hon. Friend and learn from him, but harsh reality is always difficult to communicate. However, I point out that in the past 18 months about 1 million homes have had their lofts insulated, which I suggest indicates that the message is getting through.

Mr. Hudson Davies

Will the Minister concede that persuasion, as well as understanding, is required? Will he have regard to the sums being spent by countries such as France, Germany, the United States and Sweden on fiscal measures to encourage conservation, and accept that in the last resort economic pricing is not in itself a sufficient incentive to carry out a comprehensive exercise in conservation?

Mr. Moore

All the countries that the hon. Gentleman mentioned regard economic pricing as the cornerstone of economic conservation. I accept that changing long-term attitudes is a difficult task of persuasion, but at the end of the day the total of Government expenditure is not a sufficient indicator of the long-term success of a nation's energy conservation policies. The true indicator is a change in individual demand attitudes, which is much more difficult.

Mr. Budgen

Does my hon. Friend agree that the public are entitled to know where the market price for oil is decided? Does he agree that the market price at present is decided by OPEC, which controls 90 per cent. of the oil used in the free world, and that the Rotterdam market trades in only about 10 per cent.?

Mr. Moore

I have enough difficulty explaining the Government's energy conservation policies without trying to communicate that problem.

Mr. Eadie

When we discuss conservation, does the Minister agree that the public are entitled to know that the manufacturers of insulation feel betrayed by the Government, in that their factories are working below capacity and they are forced to pay people off? How do the Government account for that when they boast about their insulation policy?

Mr. Lamont

We all recognise the difficulties in a recession, but the facts are more important. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for the Environment has just announced a 30 per cent. increase in real terms in the home insulation grant for 1981–82. The facts speak far better than comments of the kind that the hon. Gentleman has just made.