HC Deb 02 December 1981 vol 14 cc228-9
13. Mr. Frank Allaun

asked the Secretary of State for the Environment how many council houses he estimates will be started by 31 December compared with starts in each of the three previous years; and whether he proposes to take any steps to increase this number in the forthcoming year.

16. Mr. Joseph Dean

asked the Secretary of State for the Environment if there are any plans under consideration to increase the public sector building programme in 1982–83; and if he will make a statement.

The Under-Secretary of State for the Environment (Sir George Young)

In 1978 there were 67,637 local authority starts in England; in 1979, 47,465 and in 1980, 27,925. No estimates have been made of the number of council house starts in 1981 or any future years. Decisions on capital allocations for 1982–83 have yet to be made, and it will then be up to local authorities to decide how much, within their total expenditure allocations, supplemented by their capital receipts, they spend on council house building, and how much on other ways of helping those in housing need.

Mr. Allaun

Will the Minister reverse these cuts, thereby reducing the present total of 440,000 unemployed in the building, construction and related trades? Are not the overwhelming majority of the 1.4 million families now on the waiting lists entirely dependent on council housing because they cannot afford to buy?

Sir George Young

The hon. Gentleman will have to await announcements on the HIP allocations for next year. A massive public sector house building programme, based on accommodation for rent, may not be the most cost-effective or popular way of tackling the housing problem.

Mr. Dean

I am not sure, Mr. Speaker, whether these questions should have been linked, because one relates only to house building while mine concerns the public sector as a whole.

When considering housing investment programme submissions, will the Minister look sympathetically at the one submitted by Leeds, which now has a waiting list of 30,000? Is he aware that if he does look at it sympathetically, and gives a grant in accordance with the submission, it will result in a substantial cut in unemployment in Leeds, where the position has deteriorated quite alarmingly? In fact, it will give youngsters a chance to be incorporated into real jobs instead of phoney ones under the youth opportunities programme.

Sir George Young

I apologise to the hon. Gentleman if, unwittingly, his question has been inappropriately linked. I note that in the first six months of this year the Leeds council had spent only 36 per cent. of its revised allocation for the current year. I hope that there will not be any underspending in Leeds on the HIP allocation.

Mr. Dover

Is my hon. Friend aware that many of his hon. Friends support his view that there are more cost-effective ways of providing housing? Will he confirm that the number of private house building starts has increased in the same three years?

Sir George Young

I note that in September this year the number of starts for new housing and flats was 16,000 compared with 13,000 in the previous year. I confirm that there are other ways of tackling the real problems of those in housing needs—for example, more partnership schemes, more improvement for sale, more low-cost home ownership and greater mobility. One needs a broader range of solutions than the obsession with public sector accommodation for rent.

Mr. Allan Roberts

Will the hon. Gentleman ignore his doctrinaire disagreement with public sector housing and admit that the only real way to solve the nation's housing crisis is to build more homes, whether for rent or for sale? Will he also admit that the measures he has just outlined, which provide a small number of dwellings, are only a palliative and that we need a public sector house building programme financed by Government supported moneys?

Sir George Young

I feel that in this policy area the dogma is on the other side of the House. I note with great regret the fact that yesterday the right hon. Member for Manchester, Ardwick (Mr. Kaufman) said that should he ever be returned to office he would cancel the options available to tenants to buy their own homes. I consider that a short-sighted, doctrinaire decision.