South Africa (Hansard, 29 October 1980)

§ 7. Mr. Winnick
asked the Lord Privy Seal when he next expects to meet the South African Ambassador to discuss Anglo-South African relations.

§ The Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs (Mr. Richard Luce)
My right hon. Friend has no plans to meet the South African Ambassador in the immediate future.

§ Mr. Winnick
Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the 17-year imprisonment of 471 Mr. Nelson Mandela is in itself a great crime on the part of the South African authorities? Should not the British Government proclaim loudly and clearly that Nelson Mandela should be released?

§ Mr. Luce
The hon. Member may be aware that the British Government voted for resolution No. 473 at the United Nations Security Council on 13 June this year. That resolution called for the release of all those who had been imprisoned on political grounds, and that includes Mandela. The South African Government are well aware of the British Government's view on this matter.

§ Mr. Wall
Will my hon. Friend welcome the new South African Ambassador to this country; and, as the most important issue between our two countries now is the future of Namibia, will he say how the United Nations can be recognised as an impartial umpire when it takes the view that SWAPO is the sole and authentic voice of the Namibian people? I feel that that is totally untrue.

§ Mr. Luce
Of course we welcome the new ambassador. We believe in a policy of contract and dialogue between our two Governments as the most constructive approach. On the Namibian question, as my hon. Friend knows, we do not recognise, and never have recognised SWAPO as the sole and authentic representative of the Namibian people. We take the view very strongly that it is up to the people of Namibia to determine who their representative should be. The United Nations team has recently been in South Africa, and it will report shortly to the Secretary-General.

§ Mr. Robert Hughes
Is it not clear that the latest United Nations mission to South Africa has once again been met by a blank denial by the South African Government that there will be any implementation of the UN plan? Since few of the Minister's colleagues deny the legitimacy of SWAPO and South Africa also denies it, why will they not put it to the test as quickly as possible? What will the British Government do to stop the South Africans' total prevarication on this issue?

§ Mr. Luce
I am not aware where the hon. Member gets his evidence. We are still awaiting the report which Dr. Wald- 472 heim will make to the Security Council on the outcome of those extremely important talks last week in South Africa. We are not in a position to judge what progress has been made until we have that report.

§ Mr. Nicholas Winterton
Does my hon. Friend not agree that it is very important for this country to have good relations with the Government of South Africa, not only because of the strategic importance of South Africa but because that country has raw materials that are vital to the industries of the Western world? Will he not also make some statement from the Dispatch Box that we will make representations to the United Nations to ensure that not only SWAPO (E) is recognised as a negotiating body by the United Nations but that the Democratic Tumhalle Alliance, which is a multi-racial group doing wonderful work in Namibia and which has abolished all apartheid in that country, should also be recognised as a negotiating body within the UN?

§ Mr. Luce
I have been in South Africa recently and have had discussions on these problems prior to the visit of the UN team. During the course of the visit of the UN team last week, led by Mr. Brian Urquhart, discussions were held with the South African Government and leaders of several of the internal parties, including the DTA.

§ Mr. Rowlands
The Minister seems to be the only person who does not know that those talks last week broke down and that there was a stalemate. Is he not aware that continuing prevarication by the South African Government over the settlement in Namibia will only mean that more and more people will turn to the gun rather than the ballot box in order to find a solution?

§ Mr. Luce
I am very surprised that the hon. Member should make an assumption that last week's discussions led to a break-down. There is no basis upon which he can make that assumption. I hope that he will reconsider what he has said.