HC Deb 26 June 1980 vol 987 cc738-44
Q1. Mr. Skinner

asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for 26 June.

The Prime Minister (Mrs. Margaret Thatcher)

This morning I presided at a meeting of the Cabinet. In addition to my duties in this House, I shall be having further meetings with ministerial colleagues and others.

Mr. Skinner

Now that the Prime Minister and her Government have helped to smash low-paid industries such as textiles, boots and shoes, carpets and many others, now that she is sacking dinner ladies up and down the land, and now that she has shunned the nurses, does she have to use her vidictiveness against women cleaners in the various Government Departments, which has resulted in the mass lobby today following the sacking of 68 women cleaners at the Ministry of Defence at Bath and the introduction of a private contracting scheme? [HON. MEMBERS: "Too long."] Why does she not do the women in the country some good—

Mr. Speaker

Order. The hon. Gentleman must be fair to others who want to ask questions.

The Prime Minister

Dealing with the first two questions that the hon. Gentleman asked, on textiles we are carrying out the multi-fibre arrangement negotiated by the last Government. On carpets, we have secured some reduction in imports due to the action of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Trade. On the hon. Gentleman's many other complaints, I point out to him that during the year from May 1974 to June 1975 unemployment increased under his Labour Government by 54 per cent. Over the same period between 1979 and 1980 it increased by only 27 per cent.

Mr. Woolmer

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker

Can the hon. Gentleman raise it at the end of Question Time?

Mr. Woolmer

May I immediately, in the interests of correcting the Prime Minister, point out—

Hon. Members

No.

Mr. Speaker

Order. No, the hon. Gentleman may not. That was a very good try, but not good enough.

Mr. Kershaw

Does the Prime Minister recall that there was a rally in Hyde Park on Sunday at which the right hon. Member for Ebbw Vale (Mr. Foot), the deputy Leader of the Opposition, spoke against nuclear weapons? Has my right hon. Friend any information as to whether the right hon. Member for Stockton (Mr. Rodgers) is in charge of Labour defence policy—

Mr. Speaker

Order. The Prime Minister is not responsible for the Opposition. I have said that before.

Mr. David Steel

After the statement issued at the Venice summit, do the Government intend to expand investment in the coal industry? If so will the right hon. Lady look again in particular at the Department of Industry's refusal to sanction the investment necessary for the Phurnacite plant in South Wales?

The Prime Minister

Investment in the coal industry is financed by the external finance limit and is of the order of £600 million. It is not for us to say precisely where the money should go.

Mr. Anthony Grant

While I accept that my right hon. Friend is not responsible for the Opposition, may I ask whether she has, nevertheless, had an opportunity today to study the latest outbursts of the Labour Party National Executive Committee and its wild allegations against our authorities in Northern Ireland? Does she think there is any truth in that, or is there no limit to the lunacy of that crazy body?

The Prime Minister

If my hon. Friend is seeking my views on the statement of the National Executive Committee of the Labour Party against Northern Ireland, I think that the views it put forward were disgraceful.

Mr. Molyneaux

rose

Hon. Members

"Come on, Jim."

Mr. James Callaghan

rose

Mr. Speaker

Order. I had called the leader of the Ulster Unionist Party.

Mr. Molyneaux

With regard to proposals for the future administration in Northern Ireland, will the right hon. Lady ensure that any statement on those proposals will be made to Parliament, which is the body to which such suggestions should be addressed?

The Prime Minister

The proposals are expected to be published next week. They will, of course, be published in a paper which will be presented to the House of Commons. It is fully expected that my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster will provide facilities for a debate not long after that. If the right hon. Gentleman requires a statement in addition, perhaps he will consult my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster.

Later

Mr. Adley

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker. Would you care to add to your ruling about the position of my right hon. Friend in answering questions about Opposition policy? In her role as First Lord of the Treasury, she has responsibility for taxpayers' money. You must be aware, Mr. Speaker, that Opposition parties in this House are funded by the British taxpayer, and that, therefore, the British taxpayer surely has a right to know who is speaking for the Opposition on matters such as—

Mr. Speaker

Order. The answer to the question is that Ministers, including the Prime Minister, may be questioned only on those matters for which they are responsible to this House. As yet, the Prime Minister does not claim responsibility for speaking for the Opposition. [An HON. MEMBER: "Who does?"] Order. We have had enough trouble for this week. It was a frivolous point of order, if I may say so with respect to the hon. Member for Christchurch and Lymington (Mr. Adley). I have given a clear ruling, which I also gave in the previous Parliament, when I took a similar line.

Q2. Mr. Butcher

asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 26 June.

The Prime Minister

I refer my hon. Friend to the reply which I have just given.

Mr. Butcher

Does not my right hon. Friend agree that the increased application of information technology is crucial to our future economic well-being? British telecommunications engineers and software analysts are among the best in the world, and an enlightened public purchasing policy in this area could greatly assist in enhancing our skills as well as generating thousands of new jobs.

The Prime Minister

I am happy to confirm that we have an excellent information technology industry. In some spheres, such as Viewdata, Prestel, fibre optics and the new telecommunications system X, we lead. I agree with my hon. Friend that we must use public purchasing to enable those companies to increase their exports.

Mr. James Callaghan

The right hon. Lady frequently tells us that firms close and unemployment is caused because firms are not competitive. Will she tell us how she reconciles that with the letter that appeared in The Times yesterday about the caravan industry, stating that it is in an efficient industry, with a 97 per cent. share of the home market, and a healthy export record, and that it is now being brought "close to ruin" by Government policies. How does she reconcile that with her view that it is the uncompetitive firms that go bankrupt?

The Prime Minister

With regard to any particular firm that finds itself in difficulty—

Mr. William Hamilton

Industry.

The Prime Minister

—or industry—there may be a number of different reasons. Many of us remember when the former Labour Chancellor of the Exchequer put up purchase tax and value added tax to about 25 per cent. That almost ruined the caravan industry. There are a number of industries or firms that will find themselves in difficulties. That is inevitable, partly because of the world recession—to which the IMF referred today—and partly because we have not yet squeezed inflation out of the economy. The right hon. Gentleman used to give that top priority. Until we have squeezed inflation out, we shall not have a firm base from which to go forward steadily to expand.

Mr. Callaghan

When will the right hon. Lady take this problem seriously? Does she not recognise that there are industries that are competitive and that are holding their own at home and abroad? They do not fear competition, but it is alleged that, mainly as a consequence of Government policies, this industry, a healthy, growing British industry with a fine export record is close to ruin. What does the right hon. Lady intend to do about it?

The Prime Minister

We have to continue policies which, as a top priority, will try to squeeze out inflation. The most competitive companies will survive and. as the Department of Trade report announced a few days ago, they have an excellent record. The most competitive and best companies will indeed survive, and we are grateful for that.

Sir Paul Bryan

Will my right hon Friend find time today to assure our NATO allies that the policy of unilateral disarmament advocated by the Labour Party in its party political broadcast and at its one-day conference, represents the views of only a tiny fraction of the British people?

The Prime Minister

I believe that the vast majority of the British people wish everything that we stand for in this country to be well and truly defended. We believe that any policy of unilateral disarmament is a policy of unconditional surrender.

Mr. Barry Jones

Is not the future of the textile and steel towns bleak and frightening under the right hon. Lady's leadership? What urgent help can the right hon. Lady give to the sizeable township of Flint—a steel and textile-producing town which currently suffers a male unemployment rate of 36 per cent.? What urgent and fundamental change will she make in her economic strategy, to save not only this town, but British manufacturing industry?

The Prime Minister

The hon. Gentleman is asking us to change our whole economic policy—

Hon. Members

"Yes."

The Prime Minister

He is asking us to do one of three things—

Hon. Members

Resign.

The Prime Minister

To tax more, to borrow more or to print more. Which is it?

Mr. Kenneth Lewis

Is my right hon. Friend aware that there is one important matter that concerns industry and commerce in this country—indeed, in any country—represented by a 10-letter word—perhaps a "No. 10 letter word"—"confidence"? Does not my right hon. Friend accept that it is important that at this time industry should be provided with the maximum of confidence? Will she encourage her Ministers to make speeches and policies that engender confidence, because that is important?

The Prime Minister

The vast majority of people in this country have confidence that our policies will take us through to an expanding economy and greater prosperity. Those policies were confirmed by the Venice summit last weekend.

Q3. Mr. Dormand

asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for 26 June.

The Prime Minister

I refer the hon. Member to the reply which I gave earlier.

Mr. Dormand

Among her many engagements, why will not the right hon. Lady agree to meet a deputation from the Labour members of the TUC's Northern region? Is she aware that her recent, second, refusal is regarded as a major snub by the people of the North? Is she aware that the policies about which she has spoken are crucifying the Northern region, which not only has the highest unemployment rate in the country, but is now rapidly becoming a scene of devastation, not least because of the decision on the Consett steelworks. Will the right hon. Lady reconsider her decision so that we can present the case to her personally, in all its horrifying details?

The Prime Minister

The answer is "No, Sir". If the hon. Gentleman wishes to take a deputation, I am sure he will do so to one of my right hon. Friends—

Mr. Winnick

What a callous woman.

The Prime Minister

I cannot act as a court of appeal for each or any of their decisions with regard to economic policy. Does the hon. Gentleman wish to increase taxes, increase borrowing, or print more money? Which?

Sir W. Elliott

Is my right hon. Friend aware that on her very recent visit to the North-East of England, people at all levels of industry were highly impressed by her grasp of the region's difficulties and her understanding and sympathy for them? Will she take it from me that she will be most welcome in the region whenever she cares to return?

The Prime Minister

I thank my hon. Friend. As my right hon. and learned Friend the Member for Hexham (Mr. Rippon) pointed out in the debate on unemployment, the Labour Party twice doubled unemployment in the North-East, so it has nothing to boast about.