Devolution (Hansard, 23 May 1979)

§ 1. Mr. Knox
asked the Secretary of State for Scotland what proposals Her Majesty's Government propose to put to the projected all-party talks on Scottish devolution.

§ The Secretary of State for Scotland (Mr. George Younger)
The Government have indicated that they will propose the repeal of the Scotland Act. The appropriate order is already before the House and a debate will be arranged. At that stage we will indicate how we intend to proceed thereafter.

§ Mr. Knox
Since the issue of devolution will not go away, will my right hon. Friend give an assurance that the proposals he puts forward for all-party consideration will be constructive?

§ Mr. Younger
We shall certainly approach the talks, when we come to them, constructively, and in that sense I accept what my hon. Friend has said.

§ Mr. Grimond
When the Secretary of State examines this matter further, will he bear in mind that the Act contained a section which would have set up a commission to examine the administration of Orkney and Shetland? Is he aware that we would like that proposal set in motion again when the appropriate time comes?

§ Mr. Younger
I am well aware of that point. It is an issue that could be raised in the all-party talks.

§ Mr. Gordon Wilson
Since the Act received a majority in the referendum, and since the Secretary of State's party secured a smaller percentage of the vote in the election than it secured in the referendum, does he not consider that it would be an act of political wisdom if he were to retain the Act until he has a substitute which he considers to be an improvement?

§ Mr. Younger
I do not agree with the hon. Gentleman. An analysis of the referendum results shows that a large majority of people in Scotland did not feel that they could vote for the Act. That cannot be ignored.

§ Mr. Ancram
While the all-party talks are continuing will my right hon. Friend consider setting up a Select Committee to sit in Edinburgh to study the workings of the Scottish Office?

§ Mr. Younger
As my hon. Friend knows, that proposal has been made from various quarters, and it is something that would be relevant for consideration in the all-party talks.

§ Mr. Dalyell
What exactly is there to talk about?

§ Mr. Younger
The object of the all-party talks will be to establish what the various parties in the House would wish to talk about on this subject, and to see whether there is some basis for a consensus about what should be done next.

§ Mr. Henderson
Will my right hon. Friend and his colleagues recognise that if any proposals are to be effective there will have to be changes of attitude about the management of business in this House? In particular, will he consider the place of broadcasting and television in any proposals?

§ Mr. Younger
I appreciate what my hon. Friend has said, but much of its content is a matter for my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, and I shall draw his attention to it.

§ Mr. Millan
Will the Secretary of State recognise that these talks will be more likely to be meaningful if they are held 1023 before he attempts to repeal the Scotland Act? Since the views of all the other parties in the House about devolution are known, will the right hon. Gentleman accept that he cannot dodge giving the Government's view, which is what we want as soon as possible?

§ Mr. Younger
As I have said, the one thing which came out of the referendum was that the Scotland Act did not command anything remotely approaching majority support in Scotland, and I think that we should be quite wrong not to recognise that. As regards our approach, I remind the right hon. Gentleman that the object of the talks, of course, is to let all concerned make their views known, and it is quite possible that some of the parties in this matter may well have views different from those which they held a year ago.

Several Hon. Members rose
—

§ Mr. Speaker
Order. I allowed longer on that question than will be possible on other questions.