HC Deb 25 May 1978 vol 950 cc1729-30
5. Mr. Michael Latham

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he is now in a position to give details of the Government's proposals for stage 4 of the voluntary pay policy; and whether he intends maintaining the system of sanctions and blacklisting to enforce these voluntary arrangements.

Mr. Healey

Discussions are proceeding. It is too soon to say what their outcome will be.

Mr. Latham

Is not the deplorable muddle over Mackie and the Bangladesh export order typical of the shambles of this blacklist policy? Do the Government intend to allow this desirable export order to proceed?

Mr. Healey

That is a particular question, and if the hon. Gentleman tables it I shall seek to answer. On the general question of the relevance of the blacklist and other sanctions supporting pay policy, I believe that there is no doubt that the astounding success of our policy this year, which contradicts all the predictions made by the Opposition when the policy was introduced last July, is due in some part—not by any means wholly, because a great deal is due to the self-restraint and common sense of trade unionists and employers—to the ability of the Government to invoke certain sanctions in settlements which were found to be outside the guidelines.

Mr. Molloy

Does my right hon. Friend appreciate that all the pin-pricking questions attacking the Government mean that the philosophy of the Tory Party is now transparently clear, namely, that anything that is good for Great Britain annoys them and anything that is harmful and damaging to the nation brings them joy?

Mr. Healey

I have noticed a tendency of the Conservative Party to foul its own nest, but since it no longer expects to occupy our nest, I am not surprised.

Mr. Rifkind

Will the right hon. Gentleman confirm that the Crown Agents are now expected to comply with the black list? Will he accept that this will inhibit their traditional independence from Government and will be against the interests of the country?

Mr. Healey

Yes, Sir, and no, Sir.

Mr. Lawson

Will the right hon. Gentleman now answer the supplementary question asked by my hon. Friend the Member for Melton (Mr. Latham) about the black-listing of Mackie? Will he at the same time confirm whether it is true that the Government have now decided not to insist that GEC should sign clauses suggesting that it will abide by any future pay policy before receiving aid for its Merseyside investment project? By what objective criteria do the Government decide whether to invoke sanctions?

Mr. Healey

On the first supplementary question, the answer is no, Sir. The answer to the second question is—after careful study of the facts of the situation and consideration whether a particular settlement is within the guidelines.