HC Deb 10 July 1978 vol 953 cc1002-4
6. Mr. Giles Shaw

asked the Secretary of State for Industry when he next expects to have a meeting with the chairman of the Confederation of British Industry.

Mr. Alan Williams

My right hon. Friend and I will both be seeing the president and the director general of the Confederation of British Industry this evening.

Mr. Shaw

When the Minister and his right hon. Friend meet the chairman of the CBI, will they draw his attention to the results of a research survey by Opinion Research Centre published in The Daily Telegraph today which showed that the vast majority of the electorate, including those who have tended to vote Labour, are against any further extension of nationalisation? Will he tell the chairman that, in view of this fact, the Government propose substantially to revise their industrial strategy?

Mr. Williams

I leave it to the CBI representatives to decide their own reading, but I shall certainly take the opportunity to draw their attention to the disastrous consequences of an abandonment of industrial strategy which is implied in the comments from Conservative Benches, particularly the Front Bench. If I get the opportunity, I shall also ask what the CBI leaders think of the possible abandonment of present regional policy, which seems to be outlined in certain comments on the proposed policies of the Opposition.

Mr. Stoddart

When my right hon. Friend meets CBI representatives, will he draw to their attention the article in The Sunday Times yesterday that appeared to show that the largest industries in this country pay virtually no corporation tax? Is this not rather strange, bearing in mind the attitude of the CBI on taxation?

Mr. Williams

There is probably no need to draw that article to the attention of the CBI because all it says is what I and my colleagues have repeated on various occasions at the Dispatch Box, namely, that a company in this country with a continuing investment programme does not have a tax bill by the time it has received its grants and tax allowances. Unfortunately, that seems to come as a great surprise to Conservative Members.

Sir K. Joseph

Will the Minister discuss with the CBI the level of industrial profits in real terms which are catastrophically low if there is to be any hope of more jobs and more investment? Will he also discuss with the CBI whether it would be helpful for the Government to spend less so that they needed to take less out of industry?

Mr. Williams

There is no difference of view on the fact that it is good for industry to be profitable because profitable industry can invest and sustain employment. We take that for granted. I am encouraged by the fact that, as my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer pointed out, in the last six months before the recent Budget, the liquidity of the top 20 firms improved by more than £1 billion.

Mr. Mike Thomas

Will my right hon. Friend discuss with the CBI last week's comments on the radio by the right hon. Member for Leeds, North-East (Sir K. Joseph), who appeared, on behalf of the Opposition, to abandon all responsibility for wages in the public and private sectors?

Mr. Williams

What is frightening about the situation outlined by the Opposition is that they intend, apparently, to allow wages to be free in the private sector while operating a discriminating clampdown in the public sector. This is somewhat difficult to reconcile with their crocodile tears over the nurses, forces, teachers, firemen and any other workers in the public sector who make a wage claim.

Mrs. Kellett-Bowman

When the right hon. Gentleman meets the leaders of the CBI, will he discuss with them the competitive investment disadvantage of firms in areas such as my own and that of North Fylde, which do not have development area status and have to compete with firms that receive substantial capital grants because their areas have development area status? Will he discuss with them in particular firms in my constituency and fish processors in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for North Fylde (Mr. Clegg)?

Mr. Williams

If I take the advice of Opposition Members, it seems that my discussions with the CBI will overflow into the early hours of the following morning. I doubt whether I shall be discussing the issues that have been raised with the CBI representatives. I reiterate that the CBI has always recognised the need for a strong regional policy.