HC Deb 06 July 1978 vol 953 cc644-5
17. Mr. Spriggs

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he is now in a position to report progress towards the agreement which would give the Fire Brigades Union a 42-hour week; and if he will make a statement.

Dr. Summerskill

I understand that detailed proposals were tabled by the employers' side at the meeting of the National Joint Council for Local Authorities' Fire Brigades on 2nd June and considered again on 9th June. At a further meeting on 14th June, there was failure to reach agreement on the proposals and the employers' side decided to refer the matter to the Advisory, Conciliation and Arbitration Service. It is better now that the possibilities of the conciliation and arbitration machinery be pursued.

Mr. Spriggs

Is my hon. Friend aware that, as a result of Tory-controlled local authorities refusing to make an agreement on the 42-hour week with the Fire Brigades Union, a very deep sense of dangerous frustration is developing in the ranks of the union? In view of that information, when is my hon. Friend prepared to step in and give a lead to the local authorities in settling the matter?

Dr. Summerskill

It is to be hoped that both sides will resume negotiations as soon as possible, determined that they should be constructivce and that they should discuss the possible terms of reference for third party assistance.

Mr. Giles Shaw

Has the Fire Brigades Union also agreed to go to ACAS for arbitration?

Dr. Summerskill

At the moment the union has not formally agreed, but it is certainly considering that possibility.

Mr. Newens

Is my hon. Friend aware that many Fire Brigades Union members in East Anglia feel absolutely betrayed by the stand taken by Tory councils in particular throughout the country on this issue? Does she recognise that unless early action is taken there is danger of serious damage being done to the fire service as a whole?

Dr. Summerskill

I agree with my hon. Friend that this is a serious situation. The hopeful aspect is that recruitment is now proceeding in all areas of the country. It is essential that these negotiations should be completed satisfactorily very soon.