HC Deb 29 November 1977 vol 940 cc249-51
8. Mr. Nicholas Winterton

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what action she proposes to take to improve university teachers' pay and to remove disparities in their pay as compared with that of other sectors.

Mrs. Shirley Williams

I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave to the hon. Members for Somerset, North (Mr. Dean), Uxbridge (Mr. Shersby), and Birmingham, Edgbaston (Mrs. Knight) on 21st November.

Mr. Winterton

Is the right hon. Lady aware that the undergraduate student population has increased by 6.5 per cent., with only a very marginal increase of 0.07 per cent. in staff? Will she therefore consider discussing with the universities a productivity deal comparable with those negotiated in industry as a possible route to the rectification of university teachers' salary anomalies, and will she treat the matter with the utmost urgency?

Mrs. Williams

This matter has also been brought to my attention by the Association of University Teachers. There is no difference between us in taking the view that there has been an anomaly arising from the failure to pay the cost of living award in 1975, which was caught by the pay policy in the case of university teachers but not in the ease of further education teachers. The Government's view is that this anomaly must be put right as soon as the pay policy makes that possible.

Mr. Litterick

What steps has my right hon. Friend taken to develop an integrated salary structure for all academic staff in the higher education sector?

Mrs. Williams

I understand my hon. Friend's point. He will appreciate that one of the problems is that the two sectors are represented by different organisations. It is my long-term wish to rationalise further the salary payments for further education teachers in non-advanced courses and teachers in sixth-form schools.

Dr. Boyson

Is the Secretary of State aware how deep is the discontent of university teachers, who feel that the way that they have been treated since 1975 indicates that this Government are anti-academic staff and anti-university? Is she aware also that phases 1 and 2 of the incomes policy discriminate against highly trained and qualified staff and that one-fifth of the staff at the London School of Economics emigrated to America in 1976 to escape the present pay policy here?

Mrs. Williams

First, I am aware that many university teachers feel that there is a serious anomaly. Secondly, I am aware—because a number of them have said as much to me—that university teachers believe that the Government's pay policy is essential to the economic survival of the country. Thirdly, I am bound to say that the Opposition constantly play ducks and drakes with this policy and that it would be a very good idea if they came out with the truth.