HC Deb 28 July 1977 vol 936 cc911-4
2. Mr. Costain

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food what further measures he intends to take to conserve fish stocks within United Kingdom 200-mile limits.

25. Mr. Wall

asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if he will make a statement about his further discussions on a common fisheries policy and British requests for adequate conservation.

Mr. John Silkin

I refer the hon. Members to the statement that I made on 22nd July when I reported to the House the outcome of the Council of Ministers (Agriculture) on 18th-19th July. We are continuing to review the necessary further conservation measures for safeguarding fish stocks and will not hesitate to press these when the Council resumes its discussions.

Mr. Costain

I thank the Minister for that answer. Does he appreciate that the fishermen on the South Coast of England, who have seen how the French and the Belgians have over-fished their areas, are concerned about this issue? Will he confirm that he has power to bring in conservation measures that affect all nations? Will he take such action as he considers necessary, appreciating that modern electronic devices do not really give the fish a fair chance?

Mr. Silkin

I do not know about giving the fish a fair chance—it is the fishermen with whom I am primarily concerned. But the hon. Gentleman has put his finger—his fish finger—on an important point, which is that it becomes more and more clearly essential to preserve our national right to apply conservation measures. This must be the case whether or not I can negotiate a sensible permanent régime in the near future. That is something that it is vital for us to have. But that should not prevent us from looking at the sort of conservation measures that were, I think, implicit in the hon. Gentleman's Question.

Mr. Jay

Has my right hon. Friend noticed that Norway, which had the wisdom to stay out of the EEC, has obtained a 200-mile exclusive zone? Does he agree that if we had stayed out we could have done the same?

Mr. Silkin

My right hon. Friend should be aware that I consider that we have a 200-mile zone. The waters up to 200 miles from the shores of these islands are our waters, as I have so often said to the House. They are under our sovereignty and under our jurisdiction.

Mr. Hicks

Is the Minister not aware of the anxiety felt in the South-West about the future of mackerel stocks? Is he not also aware that last year double the quota recommended by his Ministry staff was fished? Can this situation go on?

Mr. Silkin

The hon. Gentleman makes a valid point. I must confess that I and my officials are deeply concerned. We may, if we are not careful, see exactly the same thing happening to mackerel as has been happening to herring. We are therefore studying the measures that will need to be taken to protect what we regard as a valuable stock—incidentally, a stock that I hope the British housewife will become more accustomed to eating. In any case, this is a stock which will be a valuable trade-off in the future.

Mr. Beith

Is the Minister aware that he will receive widespread backing in the House if he takes and prepares further measures to ensure conservation within the areas that we recognise as being needed for our British fishing industry? Does he also realise that there is a danger to our excellent record of conservation if we fail to regulate the South-West mackerel fishery?

Mr. Silkin

I thought that that was implicit in my reply. This is a matter that we are studying with a great degree of urgency. In this case study must lead to action. What is true in the South-West is true, in varying degrees, throughout the fishing areas around our shores.

Mr. Skinner

Does my right hon. Friend agree that it is rather strange—indeed, most curious—that hon. Members on the Opposition Benches, including the Liberals, but principally the Tories, while complaining about the Common Market at present are actually acting as saboteurs of the European party which the Leader of the Opposition proclaimed in that so-called famous speech somewhere on the Continent recently? Does my right hon. Friend find it necessary to answer these questions? Why bother with them? They did not seem to matter when we entered the Common Market.

Mr. Silkin

I ought not to act as an apologist for all hon. Members on the Benches opposite. As I look round, I see one or two hon. Members who at the time took much the same view as does my hon. Friend. But, on the main point, I think that it is right that these questions should be aired and points be put to me. The reason is that it strengthens my hand if I can say that, whatever the rights and wrongs and the history, the whole House and the country are determined, in a particular situation. If I can do that, it helps a great deal.

Mr. Banks

Does the Minister recognise that if we are to police our fishing grounds adequately we must have the ships to do it? In view of the drastic cuts in defence expenditure, will he make representations to his right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Defence to ensure that sufficient funds are available to enable this work to be undertaken by the Royal Navy?

Mr. Silkin

I have always believed it to be vital that we have an efficient and, if necessary, an expanded fishery protection service. I am sure that this is right, and I shall do my best to see that we have the means whereby we can protect our own fishery resources.