CBI

HC Deb 27 January 1977 vol 924 cc1684-6

7. Mr. Skinner

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer when he next plans to meet the CBI; and if he will make a statement.

Mr. Healey

I am in constant touch with representatives of the CBI at the NEDC and on other occasions. They have many opportunities of making their views known to me, and meetings are arranged as necessary.

Mr. Skinner

Will the Minister remind CBI leaders at his next meeting with them that the CBI can have no reason to complain about the way in which the Government have reacted towards it in the past two and half years? Will he tell the CBI that it has had about £8,000 million of the taxpayers' money through various forms of tax and incentives since the Government came to power, and that it is not paying much corporation tax? Will the Chancellor add that the CBI has a damned cheek to propose after workers have had a cut of £10 in their real wages, that they should be subject this year to a 3 per cent. flat wages increase? Will the Minister tell CBI leaders that that is preposterous and that he will have nothing to do with it?

Mr. Healey

I shall draw my hon. Friend's views to the attention of CBI leaders next time I meet them. I know that the views that my hon. Friend has expressed about the assistance that the CBI members have received from the Government will be reassuring to them.

As to future pay policy, all sections of the community are expressing views as to whether such a policy is desirable and, if there is to be one, the level at which it should be fixed. I shall take all representations into account.

Mr. Costain

Will the Chancellor go one better and take the hon. Member for Bolsover (Mr. Skinner) with him to the meeting in order to show the CBI what the right hon. Gentleman has to put up with daily—the tail trying to wag the dog? Would not the Chancellor receive much more sympathy from the CBI if he did that?

Mr. Healey

I shall reflect on that interesting suggestion. I hope that there will be no objections if I also take with me one or two of the hon. Member's right hon. Friends from the Opposition Front Bench so that the CBI will also be able to see what I have to put up with from that quarter.

Mr. James Lamond

Will the Chancellor also tell the CBI that many people in this country share its concern about the majority view of the Bullock Committee, but for different reasons? Will he tell the CBI that some of us think that it is wrong to enmesh workers in a scheme that is an attempt only to arrest the long-term decline of the capitalist system in this country?

Mr. Healey

I see that I am going to be the bearer of many messages from many quarters to many persons as a result of Question Time this afternoon. As to the Bullock Report, there has been a tendency for people and institutions in many parts of the country to react without due reflection on a most interesting and comprehensive report that fully carries out the purpose that the Government had in mind when the Committee was set up. Some people have overreacted. I hope that everybody concerned will take the opportunity of the consultations offered by the Government to see whether we cannot, as the Government desire, reach a lasting settlement of this problem on the basis of the maximum degree of agreement.

Sir G. Howe

While there is widespread agreement on the legitimacy of the involvement of workers in the management and understanding of the affairs of their companies, will the right hon. Gentleman understand and discuss with the CBI the widespread anxiety lest if legislation along the lines of the Bullock Committee's majority report continues to be discussed, grave damage is done to the confidence of those who would otherwise be investing in this country? What will the right hon. Gentleman do to remove that threat?

Mr. Healey

I have had the opportunity on a number of occasions in the past year or two to discuss with investors in countries such as Norway and Germany their views on worker representation at board level. The right hon. and learned Gentleman may be surprised to hear—though he should know it already—that they take a very different view of these matters from that of the Conservative Party. I hope that the period of consultation that the Government have in mind will enable hon. Members opposite to acquaint themselves with the views of many people in industry and finance overseas who, unlike the Conservative Party are not scared stiff by the thought of board representation of working people.