Industrial Democracy (Hansard, 12 December 1977)

§ 26. Mr. Ioan Evans
asked the Secretary of State for Trade when the Government will publish a White Paper on the Bullock proposals for industrial democracy.

§ 1. Mr. Radice
asked the Secretary of State for Trade when the Government will publish a White Paper on industrial democracy.

§ Mr. Dell
The Government's proposals will be published when the consultations in which we are at present engaged have been completed.

§ Mr. Evans
Will my right hon. Friend seek to persuade his Cabinet colleagues to give higher priority to self-government in industry rather than the constitutional measures relating to devolution and direct elections to Europe? Is it not as important for workers to have a say in the running of industry as for shareholders? Will the Government give priority to the public industries in setting an example to the rest of industry?

§ Mr. Dell
We have been trying to establish a consensus on this matter. My hon. Friend will remember that there was a certain change of emphasis, in my judgment, within the TUC's composite motion on this matter which suggested that the worker-director approach to industrial democracy was not the only approach to it. Certainly we believe that workers should be involved in the discussion of important decisions made by companies. We are also attempting to give an impetus to the development of industrial democracy in the nationalised industries.

§ Mr. Adley
As trade subjects are considered to be so important by the Liberal Party that it has not sent one representative to sit in the Chamber during the entire period of Question Time, will the Minister say what representations the Government have received from the Liberal Party on the Bullock proposals? We wonder how much notice to take of those representations when Members from the Liberal Party do not bother to turn up.

§ Mr. Dell
I have had discussions with the Liberal Party on the question of industrial democracy.

§ Mr. Pavitt
Will my right hon. Friend, in his consultations, give full weight to the evidence given to the Secretary of State for Employment by Glacier Metals, which for a quarter of a century has had a remarkable system of worker participation and has a number of reservations about the Bullock Report?

§ Mr. Dell
Yes. The experience of Glacier Metals is well known. I have found no lack of representations to me about the lessons to be learned from the experience of Glacier Metals.

§ Mr. Tim Renton
Does the Secretary of State regard some paragraphs of his recent White Paper on the conduct of directors as taking the place of and substituting for the majority proposals of Bullock? Does he propose to legislate on those proposals this Session?

§ Mr. Dell
The White Paper deals with a number of the minor points which were referred to in the Bullock Report. To that extent, the White Paper fulfils those elements of the Bullock Report. But it does not address itself to the major question in the Bullock Report relating to worker-directors. I have already dealt with the point about legislation and research, and I cannot guarantee that legislation will be introduced this Session on the content of the White Paper.

§ Mr. Clemitson
Is it not true that much of British industry is at the moment in a kind of no-man's-land where traditional forms of authority have declined and newer forms of industrial democracy have not yet fully developed? Is it not therefore necessary and urgent that we press ahead with the encouragement of industrial democracy as quickly as possible?

§ Mr. Dell
We certainly wish that companies should press ahead. Of course, there is no reason at the moment why they should not now do so on a voluntary basis, and we would encourage such developments.

§ Mr. Parkinson
Is the Minister aware that many of us welcome the realism shown in the recent White Paper compared with the Bullock Report, because in the Bullock Report the training for directors seems to require something of 26 the order of two to six weeks of part-time training, whereas in the White Paper it is recognised that being a non-executive director requires skill and experience and that most of those people should come from the ranks of senior management?

§ Mr. Dell
The hon. Gentleman should not underestimate the realism of the Bullock Report. The members of that committee addressed themselves specifically to the requirements of training for a director. In any case, the hon. Gentleman should also read the part of the White Paper which deals with the skills necessary under the laws of this country in a director. That section of the White Paper has already been the subject of some criticism.