§ 6. Mr. Sainsburyasked the Secretary of State for Transport if he will introduce legislation to eliminate the National Freight Corporation's deficit.
§ Mr. William RodgersAs the House knows, legislation will be introduced to provide specific statutory backing for grants paid to the Corporation to enable it to meet its financial obligations. Further proposals for eliminating the Corporation's deficit will follow when I have completed my consideration of its financial position.
§ Mr. SainsburyCan the right hon. Gentleman confirm that the aggregated losses of the nationalised parcels and small carriers services—those of the National Freight Corporation, British Rail and the Post Office—are running at the rate of about £100 million per annum? Does he agree that such a situation is totally unacceptable and places an unnecessary burden on the taxpayer, and that management action to stop it must be taken?
§ Mr. RodgersI cannot confirm the precise figure that the hon. Gentleman has mentioned hut, as the House knows, the National Freight Corporation's transactions last year resulted in a deficit that is much greater than we can tolerate. However, the current figures show an improvement. although there is still room for more. I see no reason why, in the 450 long run, the Corporation should be in receipt of a subsidy.
§ Mr. BradleyHas my right hon. Friend any plans to return two of the subsidiaries of the Corporation—National Carriers Limited and Freightliners Limited—to British Rail?
§ Mr. RodgersI have no such plans, but that does not mean that I may not have such plans. I put it in that perverse and roundabout way because this is one of the aspects that I must consider in reviewing the Corporation's present position and, equally, as part of my consideration of the consultative document. I shall bear in mind the point made by my hon. Friend.
§ Mr. GowDoes the right hon. Gentleman share the view of the Chairman of the Corporation that the present financial structure of the Corporation is
… a bad practice reminiscent of medieval usury."?Does he think that the loss of the Corporation this year will be greater or less than the £31 million it lost last year?
§ Mr. RodgersI do not wish to compete in language or in hyperbole either with the Chairman of the Corporation or with the hon. Gentleman, whose speech yesterday I missed but have read. I am led to think that the deficit will be substantially lower this year than last.
§ Mr. Robin F. CookWill my right hon. Friend confirm that in every year to 1974 the Corporation made a profit on its trading account? Will he consider legislation removing from the Corporation the expensive commitment to pensioners whom it never employed and which was the basis of the comment by the Chairman about medieval usury?
§ Mr. RodgersI am also aware of the eloquent speech that my hon. Friend made yesterday. I shall take note of the point he has made. I am willing to consider anything, including that suggestion.
§ Mr. Norman FowlerIs it not the case that the taxpayer is being asked to pay £100 million a year to support the National Freight Corporation and the deficits on British Rail freight operations? Does the right hon. Gentleman remember that the consultation document said that there was no justification for subsidising 451 freight by road or rail? Does he accept or reject that view?
§ Mr. RodgersI think that I have already said that I do not believe that in the long run we can afford to have subsidy for freight operations. But that does not mean that there are not short-term problems, which, I hope, we shall solve on a commonsense and practical basis and not assume that they can be remedied overnight.