Student Unions

HC Deb 30 March 1976 vol 908 cc1091-4

13. Mr. Cope

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if the moneys received by students' unions are accountable to central Government.

Mr. Gerry Fowler

My Department has no specific accounting responsibility, but union accounts are in general subject to independent audit.

Mr. Cope

Am I right in thinking that local authorities are obliged to pay whatever is asked by way of these fees and that the Government then pay 90 per cent. automatically in the case of mandatory grants? Is the hon. Gentleman aware that local authorities, the Government and the Public Accounts Committee have no control thereafter over the money? Is this satisfactory?

Mr. Fowler

The hon. Gentleman is right in some of the points that he makes, and notably about mandatory awards. He is not correct when he implies, in the first part of his question, that student unions simply fix their subscriptions with no control by university authorities, college authorities or, in the case of the public sector, the LEA. It is true that we do not seek thereafter to exercise control over the way in which student unions spend their income. In my view it would be most improper were we to do so.

Mr. Stokes

Will the hon. Gentleman say in what way student unions compare with trade unions, bearing in mind that students are not employees? Should students not be encouraged to think individually and not collectively?

Mr. Fowler

I trust that the intention behind much of our education provision is to encourage all young people to think individually while being aware of their collective responsibilities, as members of our society. It does not seem that membership of student unions, bringing with it a great range of benefits, discourages individual thinking.

14. Mr. Nicholas Winterton

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science if, when he next meets Mr. Charles Clarke, President of the NUS, he will make arrangements to meet representatives of students' unions that are not affiliated to the National Union of Students.

Mr. Gerry Fowler

There is nothing to prevent any student or group of students making representations to me at any time.

Mr. Winterton

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that a recent survey of student opinion clearly shows that 92 per cent. of the students interviewed felt that the present President of the National Union of Students and his Marxist leadership of that union do not represent the interests of the vast majority of students? Does the hon. Gentleman agree that it is important that all student opinion is heard by the Government?

Mr. Fowler

If the survey be correct—and I am not aware of it—it indicates that there is a low level of voting activity among students. If that were not so the present President could not have been elected. Alas, I have no ministerial responsibility for the President of the National Union of Students.

Mr. van Straubenzee

Is this not a case in which, as in the past, the robust advice of my right hon. Friend the Leader of the Opposition is to be preferred to that of my hon. Friend the Member for Macclesfield (Mr. Winterton), when she urges all those of moderate view actively to take part in their trade unions, or in organisations which are not trade unions but are representative of groups? Is it not to be greatly desired that moderate students be encouraged to take part in the activities of the National Union of Students and not to chicken out of it?

Mr. Fowler

I wish to encourage all students to take part in the activities of their unions. The degree of moderation of each of them may be a matter of judgment.

Mr. Skinner

Is it not worth noting that the Tory Party is now giving encouragement to the break-up and fragmentation of the National Union of Students? It is the same party which complains about the multiplicity of trade unions in some of our industries. How does my hon. Friend reconcile the two points of view?

Mr. Fowler

I can only say that I agree entirely with my moderate hon. Friend.

16. Mr. Tim Renton

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what is his policy with regard to compulsory membership of student unions.

Mr. Gerry Fowler

In general, compulsory membership is prescribed in the statutes or articles regulating the conduct of the institution concerned. I support this, as otherwise it would be impossible to provide a wide range of social and recreational facilities.

Mr. Renton

The Minister's answer to the supplementary question from my hon. Friend the Member for Gloucestershire, South (Mr. Cope) was thoroughly unsatisfactory. Is it not time the Minister discovered and then told the House the total cost of union dues, to the ratepayer and the taxpayer, bearing in mind that from one large local education authority the costis now about 250,000?

Mr. Fowler

As I said in my answer, we regard it as essential that student unions should have compulsory membership where they so desire it and should be able to provide a wide range of social and recreational facilities, without which the whole quality of student life would be impoverished.

Mr. Stonehouse

Does not the word "university" imply that such an institution is open for all expressions of view, however controversial, to be made within them? Is it not deplorable that the right hon. Member for Down, South (Mr. Powell) cannot accept a long-standing invitation to Brunei University because of the activities of a minority of members of the student union there who have threatened to create chaos if he should go?

Mr. Fowler

I deplore, as I have always deplored, any attempt by student unions or any other group to restrict freedom of speech in this country.

Mr. Powell

Will the Minister confirm that "university" takes its name simply from "universitas", which means the whole body of the colleges?

Mr. Fowler

As a Latinist, I am glad to do so.

Mrs. Bain

Will the Minister bear in mind that the vast majority of student unions in Scotland, compulsory or voluntary, believe that Scottish universities, with the rest of Scottish education, should be under the control of the Scottish Assembly?

Mr. Fowler

I admire the hon. Lady's ingenuity.