HC Deb 17 March 1976 vol 907 cc1306-7
11. Mr. Michael Marshall

asked the Secretary of State for the Environment whether he has received any representations from the TUC concerning the appointment of trade unionists to sit as councillors on local authorities.

Mr. John Silkin

My right hon. Friend received representations from the TUC last year proposing that representatives of employees should sit on all local authority committees. In this connection I would draw the hon. Member's attention to the statement of the Government's views on industrial democracy in the public sector, contained in the reply given by my hon. Friend the Minister of State, Civil Service Department on 11th February 1976.

Mr. Marshall

Would the right hon. Gentleman make it clear that a dangerous and important principle is at stake here and that the notion that nominated representatives should serve on elected bodies in local government, if carried through, would mean that he was likely to face nominated gauleiters sitting in his own Ministry and the Cabinet?

Mr. Silkin

I think that the hon. Member has gone a little way from his original Question. [HON. MEMBERS: "No."] Perhaps I should read the words. He asked me about the appointment of trade unionists to sit as councillors. In my reply I said that the TUC had asked that they should sit on local authority committees, and there is a difference. It was important to get that clear.

I take the substantive point. While we rightly believe that industrial democracy is vital and applies equally to local authorities as to any other public or private enterprise, the election of councillors is very much a matter for the electorate. For that reason, my hon. Friend the Minister of State, Civil Service Department made his statement.

Mr. George Rodgers

Would my right hon. Friend agree that for many years local authorities with educational responsibilities have included teachers' union representatives and representatives of the Church in some of their deliberations and that this has been a valuable addition to local government work?

Mr. Silkin

I think that it has. Again, I would ask my hon. Friend to look at the reply to the hon. Member for Arundel (Mr. Marshall) and the distinction that I first drew, which, surprisingly, Conservative Members did not seem to understand.

Mr. Speed

We are in agreement on one thing at least, I think. Can the Minister make it clear that there is no question, so far as the Government or the Opposition are concerned, of people being nominated directly to main councils, since everyone in the country is represented by a councillor?

Mr. Silkin

Yes, I do not think that there is any question about that. I thought that I had made it clear.