HC Deb 06 July 1976 vol 914 cc1152-4
9. Mr. Litterick

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science whether he will pursue policies likely to produce increases in the number of mature students taking full-time courses in further and higher education; and whether he will make a statement.

The Minister of State, Department of Education and Science (Mr. Gerry Fowler)

The Government's planned expenditure to 1979–80 provides for an increase in student numbers in further and higher education, which is expected to include an increase in the numbers of mature students taking full-time courses.

Mr. Litterick

Does my hon. Friend agree that in view of the massive levels of unemployment confidently forecast by the Chancellor of the Exchequer to persist through the rest of the 1970s, money spent on the financing of adult students in higher education institutions would be a valuable component in the fight against unemployment? Will he give the House an assurance that his Department is mindful of that fact, and mindful of the obligation to resist the cuts that may well be imposed again by the Treasury? Finally, will he accept my congratulations on his victory over the Treasury, which he announced yesterday?

Mr. Fowler

I have some sympathy with the first part of my hon. Friend's question. However, he will recall that in 1974 we changed the eligibility for mandatory awards so that any student admitted to a first degree course, for example, would be entitled to a mandatory award whatever his entry qualifications. Although admission arrangements are matters for individual institutions, I hope that they will give proper weight to the requirements of mature students.

Mrs. Bain

Is it not the case that the Government's policy in terms of public expenditure cutbacks is forcing local authorities into a situation in which they cannot encourage mature students to take up further and higher education? Does he agree that this is a far cry from the previous Prime Minister's statement that we were entering a period of white hot technological revolution?

Mr. Fowler

No, I do not agree with that proposition. I know of nothing in present policy which is discriminatory against mature students.

10. Mr. Thorne

asked the Secretary of State for Education and Science what plans he has for increasing the numbers of students in further and higher education in preparation for industrial expansion in the early 1980s.

Mr. Gerry Fowler

The Government's plans, including projections of student numbers in higher and further education, are set out in the White Paper "Public Expenditure to 1979–1980", Command 6393, though some adjustment may be necessary in the light of yesterday's announcement about the future level of tuition fees and numbers of overseas students.

Mr. Thorne

Does my hon. Friend agree that increases in public expenditure in this sector of further education are completely in accordance with Labour's manifesto, and that any question of reductions would be completely opposite to the promises that we gave to the electorate? Will he resist any further cuts?

Mr. Fowler

The White Paper indicated that expenditure in this area would provide for an increase in student numbers for the next four years. We hope that increase will take place. We shall give high priority to meeting increased demand from the 16–19 age group.

Dr. Hampson

Does the Minister agree that it would be better for students to go into full-time courses in further education rather than to sit around on the dole, or to take the TSA courses now being set up? What liaison does he have with the Manpower Services Commission and the Department of Employment to try to further the entry of students into further education colleges?

Mr. Fowler

I can express no view on the question whether it would be preferable for an individual student to take a course of further education, and further education alone, or to undergo a course of further education and training under the TSA scheme. That is a matter for judgment in each individual's case. My collaboration with the Manpower Services Commission and the Department of Employment on these matters is very close.

Mr. Evelyn King

Does the hon. Gentleman accept that there is no real evidence that there will be any expansion in the 1980s? Whether there is or is not, does he accept that it is necessary not to increase or decrease the number of students but to have more regard to the subjects that they study? Is he aware that in some areas there is a surplus while in others there is a deficiency?

Mr. Fowler

I cannot accept the first part of the hon. Gentleman's question. As for the latter part, my right hon. Friend has already explained today that we have exceedingly limited powers over curricula. In fact, we have none over school curricula. As regards FE curricula, we cannot steer student choice between particular disciplines.