§ Q1. Mr. David Steelasked the Prime Minister if he will list his engagements for 15th January.
§ The Prime Minister (Mr. Harold Wilson)I chaired a meeting of the Cabinet this morning and have had a number of meetings with my colleagues and others. This evening I shall be chairing a meeting at 10 Downing Street of the relevant political parties in this House on security in Northern Ireland.
§ Mr. SteelDoes the right hon. Gentleman have it in mind to attend any more of the devolution debate in the House? Is he aware that if he had been here yesterday, he would have heard, in contrast to his own intransigent speech, a speech by that new man of flexibility, the Lord President of the Council, who told us that the Government would consider the constitutional powers of the Secretary of State, whether the Law Officers ought to be the judges of what is ultra vires, and whether there might 577 be separate Bills for Wales and Scotland? Can the right hon. Gentleman give us an assurance that the Government's conduct of the debate will continue in that vein? If so, we might end up with an acceptable basis for devolution.
§ The Prime MinisterYou have ruled, Mr. Speaker, that answers to this newly developed Question should deal with the engagements I have attended or propose to attend and not to others. I did look in on the debate last night. I have had full reports about it. I thought that my right hon. Friend the Lord President made a very constructive speech, as did his colleagues, on this subject. The assurances that were given will be fully honoured. We are listening to the debate as well as taking part in it.
§ Mr. AtkinsonWould not my right hon. Friend agree that it is somewhat surprising that he has not taken the opportunity today to say farewell to the departing American Ambassador, Mr. Elliot Richardson, so that he could at the same time secure from him some assurances about the activities in this country of the CIA? Is my right hon. Friend aware that for the first time, to the knowledge of many of us, the Americans have agreed that there is a considerable force of CIA employees at work in this country, apparently engaged in overt political activity? Can my right hon. Friend give an assurance that the work of the CIA that he has endorsed does not involve any political activity, but concerns normal secret service work?
§ The Prime MinisterYou have ruled, Mr. Speaker, that meetings I do not have are not in order on this Question. I pay tribute to the retiring United States Ambassador, who has had a brief but constructive period in this country. Not least do I pay tribute to him for the lead he has given on the subject of North American aid to terrorism in Northern Ireland. He has made it clear that he will pursue that endeavour when he returns to America. There is no ministerial responsibility for the CIA.
§ Mrs. ThatcherAs the Prime Minister pointed out in his reply that he chaired a meeting of the Cabinet this morning, may I ask him to say whether he has 578 given any fresh advice to his senior colleagues about how they should react to requests to appear before parliamentary Select Committees? Is he aware that many of us, whether on the Front or Back Benches, would regard such a request as mandatory? Does the right hon. Gentleman regard it in that way?
§ The Prime MinisterAgain you have ruled, Mr. Speaker, that what comes out of the Cabinet is not a matter which is normally reported to the House. No Conservative Prime Minister has ever answered any question of this kind—
§ The Prime MinisterBecause such questions were never put in those days. Nevertheless, this subject is not a matter for the Cabinet. The appearance of Ministers before the House or its Committees is arranged in the same way as it is at Question Time. The Government decide which Minister answer Questions on particular matters. The same should be the case with Select Committees. Ministers who have responsibility for particular questions are available to Select Committees more than ever before in the history of the House, but it is not a question of 23 or 24 Members of the Cabinet being called before a Select Committee, each to express his or her own view. This Government, unlike that of which the right hon. Lady was a member, accept the principle of collective responsibility.
§ Mrs. ThatcherIs the Prime Minister therefore saying that the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster had no responsibility whatsoever in the Chrysler matter?
§ The Prime MinisterThe Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster had no ministerial responsibility in this matter. The Ministers with ministerial and departmental responsibility are fully at the service of the House in a way the right hon. Lady's right hon. Friends never were.
§ Mr. William HamiltonIs my right hon. Friend aware that he has enunciated an extremely important principle which should be abrogated by every Back Bench Member? Does he not accept that Select Committees are empowered to send for persons and papers, which is quite different from the procedure in 579 the House? If any Select Committee asks for a particular Minister, can my right hon. Friend give us an assurance that the Minister and not a substitute well attend?
§ The Prime MinisterYes, providing the Minister is relevant to the inquiries. My hon. Friend and I were simultaneously chairmen of the two principal Select Committees of this House, and we are now following the procedures followed by those Select Committees.
§ Mr. William HamiltonNo, we are not.