Arms, Ammunition and Explosives (Hansard, 2 December 1976)

§ 2. Mr. Gow
asked the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland what evidence he has about the source of arms, ammunition and explosives which arrive in the Province unlawfully; and if he will make a statement.

§ The Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mr. James A. Dunn)
It would not be in the interests of security to reveal the full nature of evidence available to us. I can, however, say that we have reason to believe that the flow of arms across the Atlantic has been reduced. As for weapons of East European origin, there is no evidence to suggest that terrorists obtain more than a small proportion of their weapons from that source.
As regards explosives arriving unlawfully in Northern Ireland, our belief that most of the commercial explosive recovered originates in the South is, I think, well known. The origin of improvised explosive cannot be established with certainty. The Irish Government, with whom we are in regular contact, share our concern to prevent supplies of explosive material reaching the hands of illegal holders.

§ Mr. Gow
As the story of violence and terror continues unabated in Northern Ireland, will the Minister confirm that the Government are taking all the diplomatic steps open to them to impress upon foreign Governments that the supply of money as well as of arms and ammunition, although illegal, is causing increasing concern to Her Majesty's Government?

§ Mr. Dunn
I can give the assurance that the hon. Gentleman seeks. We are seeking in every avenue to discuss these matters in great detail with those countries which may be able to help us.

§ Mr. Kilfedder
Is it true that since the emergence of the Peace People movement and their trips abroad there seems to be 1141 a greater awareness and understanding of the threat to decent people in Northern Ireland as a result of money and arms being sent from abroad to the Provisional IRA in Northern Ireland? Has the Minister any evidence to show that there is a drying-up as a result of this, and can the Government help further to stop up the sources?

§ Mr. Dunn
I think that what the peace movement has been able to achieve is of great significance to Northern Ireland. I have no evidence to suggest that through the work that it has performed and the opportunities that it has given in the Province it has been instrumental in stopping the flow of arms. I wish to goodness that I could say that it had.

§ Rev. Ian Paisley
What proportion of explosions recently have taken place as a result of the laying of commercial gelignite, and what proportion through improvised explosives? What steps is the Minister taking to try to seal the border against the import of such explosives?

§ Mr. Dunn
On the first two questions that the hon. Gentleman asked, I cannot give him the statistical evidence that he is seeking. With regard to the border, every effort is being made to police what crossings remain open and we are keeping a careful watch with vehicle checkpoints and patrols. More than this we cannot do at the moment.

§ Mr. Freud
Would the Minister consider using the public relations department in the United States to impress upon the people of the United States the total lack of glamour which is inherent in providing aid to Northern Ireland, or Ireland as a whole, because, at this moment—especially with regard to what Mr. President-elect Carter has announced—there are still appeals for money which people think will do good, rather than the incredible harm that it does?

§ Mr. Dunn
I am pleased to tell the House and the hon. Gentleman that we have received good co-operation from the United States as well as from Canada and North America.