§ 8. Mr. Gwynfor Evansasked the Secretary of State for Wales what is his policy in regard to the costs of the Cleddau Bridge; and if he will make a statement.
§ Mr. John MorrisThe decision to build the bridge was taken by the Pembrokeshire County Council, which was told that no Government assistance would be available. I regret the unfortunate event which contributed to the greatly increased cost but after careful and sympathetic consideration I can hold out no prospect of Government aid.
§ Mr. EvansIs the Secretary of State aware of the distress and deep feeling caused in Dyfed by the Government's scandalous rejection of their moral responsibility for much of the increase in costs from £3 million to £12 million? Is he aware that it was the establishment of the Merrison Committee and the insistence on awaiting the report from that committee and the implementation of its recommendations—at a time of mounting inflation—that have been the main cause of this escalation in costs? Is he further aware that in the case of Ronan Point, where a tragic accident took place in a local government sector, the Government were prepared to meet the increased and unexpected costs? Why are the Government not prepared to do that in Wales at a time when an increase 467 of £1½ million per year will otherwise be added to the Dyfed ratepayers' burden?
§ Mr. MorrisI have looked carefully into this matter. There is no comparable case for paying a subsidy at this stage to the county council. I certainly do not accept that either the present or the previous Government, under whom the matter arose, had any moral responsibility. The decision was taken by the Pembrokeshire County Council to go it alone unilaterally to build the bridge. Does the hon. Gentleman expect me to rob the rest of Wales of its share of the Road Fund, or to stop or delay the M4, so as to provide funds and bail out the Pembrokeshire County Council at this juncture?
The truth about Ronan Point is that the Government subsidised the building and clearly had a close concern in safety and design aspects. None of these is a Government responsibility in respect of the bridge. The Merrison Committee was needed because of what happened in Pembrokeshire and elsewhere. It was for Pembrokeshire to decide whether to accept the recommendations of Merrison. I should have thought that no one in his right senses could have taken any other course.
§ Mr. Nicholas EdwardsI am glad that the Secretary of State added that last sentence about there being no option to take any other course. Is the Secretary of State aware that after the Pembrokeshire County Council took the decision to go ahead with the bridge it was faced with the unforeseeable disaster, and that the decision that now confronts us is not about additional Government expenditure but about whether the expenditure that has been incurred should be met fairly out of the general tax revenue, or unfairly by the ratepayers and the consumers? Does not the Secretary of State agree that, confronted by the strong representations of all the local authorities and Members of Parliament concerned, at least he has an obligation personally to meet a deputation to discuss the matter?
§ Mr. MorrisI am always prepared to meet delegations whenever there is anything worthwhile to say. In this case two deputations have been met by the Under-Secretary—
§ Mr. EdwardsNot by the Secretary of State.
§ Mr. MorrisThe hon. Member is right to say that they were not met by me, but I have been there myself, I have heard the representations, and I attended the official opening. I fear that there is nothing new, and it would be a complete waste of public money for another delegation to be brought to see me, either in Cardiff or in London, unless there were something new to say. If there were anything new, I would be the first, ready and willing, to hear new representations.
The hon. Gentleman said just before the election not that a Tory Government would subsidise the bridge but, speaking with all the authority of a Conservative spokesman, that there would be no tolls levied on the bridge if the Tories came to power. I shall be glad to hear that repeated and I look forward, as a ratepayer in Dyfed, to that being implemented if we have the misfortune of the hon. Gentleman's party in office.
§ Mr. Geraint HowellsI am aware that the right hon. and learned Gentleman has agreed to meet a deputation from Dyfed County Council within the next year. Will the Secretary of State visit representatives of Dyfed County Council once again and keep close liaison between the Welsh Office and the county council?
§ Mr. MorrisI am not aware of any decision to meet the county council within a year. However, as I have said, if any new facts emerge, I am always ready and willing to meet delegations. Nothing has been indicated to me, either in writing or orally, to suggest that there are any new facts. It would be an utter and complete waste of public money if, without any new facts, delegations of county councillors were to troop to Cardiff or London to see me at great expense when there is nothing new to say. Two delegations have already been seen.
§ Mr. EvansIn view of the very unsatisfactory nature of the Secretary of State's reply, I wish to give notice that I shall raise this matter at the earliest opportunity on the Adjournment.